Escape Artists
Escape Pod => Episode Comments => Topic started by: Russell Nash on March 21, 2008, 10:34:22 AM
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EP150: This, My Body (http://escapepod.org/2008/03/21/ep150-this-my-body/)
By Jeremiah Tolbert (http://www.jeremiahtolbert.com/).
Read by Stephen Eley
I am the lover. I am the chef. I am the preterite priest.
I am the secret, unknowable ingredient. You may taste me a thousand times, but never hold my essence on your tongue or capture it in your memory.
I am the flavor of ecstasy. Taste me and know God.
–Prayer of the Assaisonnement Saints
Rated X. Contains graphic sexual and culinary scenes.
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I liked this story a lot (it vaguely brought to mind a story from a while back about a dolphin falling in love with his trainer.) Sexuality and food are concepts that go hand in hand very well; both are/can be sensual things, engaging many of our senses. At some restaurants in Japan, you can even order a sushi meal that will be served on a woman's body (although I'm pretty sure you're not allowed to eat it directly off her :D). I found the concept of a human body engineered to enhance food flavors quite spiffy as well, and the blending of sexuality and religion brings to mind Jacqueline Carey's 'Kushiel' books.
I sometimes have a problem with a high degree of sexuality in a story because it comes off as gratuitous and sometimes ends up dominating any other plot lines. (Laurell Hamilton, I'm lookin' at you). In this case I think it worked out OK exactly because the narrator was so blase, even bored with it; it served as a good medium for demonstrating the degree to which he had been dehumanized.
He trying to be human, trying to feel, but didn't know how, exactly, nor how to read other people properly, and in doing so caused his own outcasting.It seems to me that at it's core the story is about identity. The desire to know onesself and be known as more than just an object. And despite his errors, I daresay the ending was even hopeful, as he seemed determined on adjusting to his new physical and emotional freedoms.
I also enjoyed the story's language; it was a fairly eloquent, perhaps even lyrical, piece, which kind of fits in with the religion angle, I think.
I would have, perhaps, liked a bit more detail about the motivations for the Contessa's behaviors. I felt like I was missing part of the story.
Oh, and huzzah for reaching episode 150! :D
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Wow.. great story, but reading it as an asexual person was pretty disturbing. I realize that the main character isn't asexual in the sense that we know it today (see www.asexuality.org for more info) but there were enough parallels to make it deeply, deeply creepy. Rather than taking things personally and getting offended (which rarely helps matters) I'll point out some of the differences this character to and a real-life asexual person:
- Asexual people aren't robbed of our humanity just because we don't like sex. We have the same emotions, the same need to connect with people, etc. A lot of this dehumanization could be explained by this character's religious brainwashing, but the image of asexual automoton (or near-automoton) is one that shows up a little too often.
- The fact that someone finds sex boring doesn't mean that they're cool with being institutionally raped. Again, the story's religious brainwashing may have had something to do with this, but the extent to which the story celebrated the eroticism of what (to me) read as rape was pretty disturbing.
It seemed like the point of the story was that the main character was food (in the sexual, spiritual, and literal sense). The human-to-food transition was accomplished largely by taking away the main character's sexuality, and the notion that people who don't like sex should be treated as less than human wasn't really challenged as much as I would have liked it to be.
That being said, it's not a story about me or asexual people in general and I'm not going to take it personally. Just sayin'....
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Great story. It kept me in rapt attention for the whole time. Excellent.
Loved the idea of a guy who was a food / sexual / and spiritual need all-in-one. Like Talia mentioned, it reminded me of the meals that are served on a naked body, which have been in the media lately. The part that felt odd to me was the religious aspect of the main character. I didn't quite understand how people would worship such a person or how he could be considered a priest. But I guess when you consider the eccentricities of real world religions that shouldn't be so surprising. And when the guy was having so much sex with the attractive Contessa that he was sore and aching all over - yow!
....
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Holy crap, Steve Eley's narration of a human food ingredient/sex toy made me gay.
And somehow I wish it would happen more often.
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This story made me hungry. Not horny, but hungry.
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I both liked and disliked the story. I think it was fairly formulaic in that we KNEW he would end up meeting and doing something wrong with the daughter. But the idea was very strong, and the descriptions, and the fact that he cooks with various body parts... both interesting and mildly unpleasant (to me) at the same time.
So, not bad. Not great, but not bad.
And how I am the first person to post this??????
(http://icanhascheezburger.wordpress.com/files/2007/08/128294431887657500ihasaflavort.jpg)
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I didnt like this story, it was a weak story idea from the start and then having it stretched to an hour just made it boring.
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I'd like to comment on Steve's opening remarks about Arthur C. Clarke.
So ... I will.
Heinlein was the writer who made us say "Wow. this is neat!"
Asimov showed us that logic and reason could make good drama and strong story.
Clarke is the one who taught us awe.
*polite golf clap*
Very nicely put.
If it was me saying it, I'd tack on "Bradbury is the poet".
And how I am the first person to post this???
[lolcat image]
Well, it it could all too rapidly get out of hand.
(http://i6.tinypic.com/6873fpt.jpg)
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I was surprised by how much I enjoyed this story, and how rapt it kept me. Considering it was an hour long, that's no small feat.
I didn't quite understand how people would worship such a person or how he could be considered a priest. But I guess when you consider the eccentricities of real world religions that shouldn't be so surprising.
The first thing I thought of with the religion/sex aspect was temple prostitutes. That's not a perfect analogy, because I think the story works better when religion and food both feed a similar appetite. Still, I'm pretty sure that back in the day having sex with temple prostitutes was considered a sacred act. Maybe not evangelical, but one of worship. (Someone with more knowledge can correct me if I'm wrong.)
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I just didn't have the stomach for this story.
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And how I am the first person to post this??????
[lolcat image]
I HAS A FLAVOR came to mind the first time I heard the narrator say "my flavor".
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Like Pressure, I found the distortion to human anatomy strangely disturbing. Both surprised me at the amount they made me uncomfortable. But as for the rest of the story, I just couldn't get into it. I lost interest pretty early on, fast-forwarded to the comments only to discover there were none. I did like Steve's commentary on Clarke, though, even though I can't say I've ever read anything by him (I usually say I like to read fantasy and watch sci-fi… about the only SF I've read that I got as absorbed as fantasy was the Dune series).
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FOOD PORN!
I enjoyed this story. There weren't any great hitches in the flow, and the eroticism was handled very well. Anything sexual and erotic in nature is difficult to do well on paper. Often is is over-the-top graphic when simple suggestion is more than enough.
I need more background on the religion presented for me to really 'get' the story. I felt unfulfilled when the end came because I had no real context for, what seemed to be, the main fulcrum of the story: God moving in mysterious ways.
I first took this religion as a riff on Catholicism, given the monastic ways and corporate nature of the inner workings, but just couldn't make it stick. So, next I thought it might be something Hindo-ish, where there is a belief that the stomach is the ultimate enjoyer of all things much like Vishnu is the ultimate enjoyer, and so pleasing the stomach is doing homage to Krishna.
What I really needed to see was some of the worship that went in to the meals. Where was the prayer? The ritual?
With out these I'm having a hard time grasping the kind of world the Assaisoma (sp?) was coming from, and just what the Contessa was hoping to get from him.
Shwankie, and she may weigh in on this more herself, saw sex with the Assaisoma to be like sex with a temple prostitute, and while I can see how they were being treated similarly, it doesn't really explain why the Contessa was so obsessed with him. It seems like anyone who made use of the temple prostitutes, whatever the century, would know it was a sham.
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I'm not a big fan of stories about food or faith, but I really liked the author's earlier story, Instead of a Loving Heart, so I stuck it out and quickly found myself in touch with the main character. Both stories have strong imagery and emotion -- you can taste "lonely" when this story ends. Great selection, Stephen!
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I really cared about this character and found the world and religion fascinating. I agree that the eroticism was handled with effective subtlety. As a listener I shouldn't get excited over a sex scene being narrated by someone who doesn't like sex.
My sticking point is that I wonder if all the food stuff was necessary. It was very cool and interesting -- it seems like the armpits and groin would be the best places from which to impart flavor, but I'm thankful I was spared a description of this -- but I'm not sure that it did anything for the story besides window dressing.
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It's interesting to think about how people would react to this story if the main character had been female. It really shouldn't make a difference to the character itself, but I'm sure people would react to the sex much more as rape. Which, well, it was. But somehow it's more okay if it's a male in that situation, even though we're told repeatedly that he doesn't want or enjoy it.
That being said, I'm glad the author chose a male Assaisoma, so that the deeper issues can get examined without the kneejerk cultural response dominating the feelings about the story. I do think the Assaisomas were supposed to be like temple prostitutes. And I actually do think it's possible to get spiritual enlightenment or "know God" through Earthly pleasures like sex and food. Though most certainly no one in the story was going about that with the right mindset to actually accomplish it.
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Interesting idea, but it didn't gel for me. I really didn't care for, or even particularly like, any of the characters except for the chef (Girard? Jeremy?), and I was rather disappointed when he turned out that he had been an Assaison (sp?) but hadn't bothered to tell Antonio about it, until they were never going to see each other again. Under the circumstances, it seems like the kind of thing you'd tell a friend. Especially when he's asking about love. That kind of changed him from the only person in the story who realised that other people might possibly have their own feelings into a dick.
And I was curious abut the parallel between the Contessa thinking that God owed her something, and using Antonio to try and find it, and the final lines in which Antonio seems to decide much the same thing. Is he going to use the same methods, despite knowing how toxic that could be for his own Assaison? Does this imply that the Contessa had previously been an Assaison?
Or am I reading too much into a casual similarity of words?
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I found this story both disturbing and satisfying in its twist on religious views. Heavy eating and extraneous sex seems generally considered sins in many modern religions. I considered myself rather liberal in my views, but somehow the rich depictions of the sacred and what may be considered profane bothered me more than I thought it would. I also was not surprised by the emptiness the main character felt and identified with his lack of faith. Nor was I surprised by the inability of the Contessa to find what she was looking for by attempting to satiate her desire.
I enjoyed the rich textures the author was able to wrap each scene in. I found the characters believable and interesting. The ability of the main character to misjudge each person he meets made him more human and likeable, despite his calculating and emotionless state. I myself was fooled by the Contessa with his evaluation. He reminds me of Pinochio, but not knowing he want to be a boy, only knowing he wants something more.
It seemed to me that the point of the story was how God could be just as likely to be found in the mundane as it could in the indulgent. The former assasione chef turns out to be the character that brings the most purpose to the main character than anyone else. He turns his mundane cooking work, with no genetic enhancements nor sexual eroticism, into an appealing and peaceful activity that brings true satisfaction. He stays aloof of the main storyline until he is needed and then brings enlightenment in his final act which shows the assasione that there are other ways to find his fulfillment. The author alludes to the more by the simple orange and the Contessa and Cound watching him leave. Very subtle.
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(http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/funny-pictures-flavor-running-chicken.jpg)
To atone, my comments.
I liked it, especially the little throwaways giving some world-building (mainly the X plant is no longer available/rare).
I didn't find the religion/gluttony/sex thing that far off, though I was thinking of this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taoist_sexual_practices) instead of the more western-style religion that it was clearly based off of. And there have certainly been some pretty deviant Popes back in the day.
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I have some technical comments to make about the story.
First of all, I like the message that the story had about human rights. I was recently at a conference where modern day abolitionist David Batstone was discussing what we could do to end modern day slavery that exists in the United States. I highly recommend his book Not For Sale. Male or female, for a religious reason or for pure human gratification, it doesn't matter; the exploitation of another human's body in the way this story described is wrong. It's a tough stance for someone to take in a fictional piece, so I applaud Jeremiah Tolbert for broaching the subject.
On the other hand, I do have some criticisms which run more toward the structural. I would have liked to have seen the flashback to Br. Antonio's presented more as an actual sequence of scenes rather than just a monologue. I think it would have been more influential if I could've seen the character develop more from a small child to a detached human icon. Instead we're just told how it happened, and that left me flat.
Secondly, I was incredibly jarred out of the story at the point of the flashback because it was told in past tense while the rest of the piece was in present. consistency in presentation would have made the story smoother.
Finally, I have a hard time really considering this science fiction. Sure, there is the genetic manipulation that occurs, but that's not really enough. Take that out, and the part about Br. Alberto's tasty skin, and you're pretty much left with a story that could happen anywhere in the world on two levels. The first level being the commentary of religion and a religious leader who is disenchanted with his sect's particular doctrines. The second level being the human rights level in which a person is manipulated into an immoral contract and has no recourse to authority.
As a side thought, I wonder what his blood would taste like. Interesting connotations for transubstantiation there.
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FOOD PORN!
My thoughts exactly.
I like the fact that the author made the food-sex connection. Both are very primitive, physical pleasures, and I've always thought them similiar.
Beyond that, the story just didn't grab me. I can't find any technical flaws or obvious gaffes, it just wasn't very interesting for me.
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Okay, it had to be done:
(http://bp0.blogger.com/_YDMo7jDRJeU/Rol51Rhc3gI/AAAAAAAACXw/dYDNVM8DSu0/s320/FlavaFlav.jpg)
(Cuz everything ya eats gots Flava!)
Now THAT's out of the way, yeah... interesting story. A few folks touched on the question of the religion, but I
As for what Djdj said about the character not representing asexual folk, I didn't think that was quite what the author intended to represent. A lot of folks feel a profound sense of "rapture" at orgasm (just in case anyone didn't know that), and while most religions try to remove the distractions through ascetism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ascetic), others (including this order) try to remove the distraction by over-satisfying, or desensitizing through over-indulgence.
The Assaisonnement (spelling courtesy of the snippet in the initial post) were supposed to have been "turned off" in order to keep them from getting in between the Devourists (my own spelling guess) and God. The priests are the "instruments" for helping the Devourists get past their physical passions so they could see God, and the priests aren't supposed to feel love or desire. I imagine this would let people tell themselves, "It's not a sin if it's their job" or something along those lines.
As was pointed out by others, this servitude is slavery and rape, and clearly not Antonio's choice, but the Order seems to have rationalized that because they took him in and "gave him training and therapy" that this is some great favor, and something that he would have chosen to do.
But basically, I took the story as a commentary on the different ways people seek to find their spirituality externally, when it's usually simply inside themselves in the first place. Contessa was seeking it through intense practice of her faith; Antonio wanted to get out from under his contract, and find his own way. And if read in that light, it highlights the dangers of following any particular organized faith to a logical extreme, because in the end, they can* end up leading people even further astray than they thought they were to begin with.
*Note: I said "can" not "do" and not "inevitably will"
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*Note: I said "can" not "do" and not "inevitably will"
For what it's worth, I appreciate this delineation. :) (I struggled to find the right word there (validation?, qualification?... ahcrapi'mtiredthis'llwork), and I still don't think I got the one I wanted... not that I would have taken the unasterisked comment to mean "do", but still, for whatever reason, I appreciated it, even if I can't figure out exactly why).
Someday, I'd be interested in hearing what "taking organized faith to its logical extremes" means. I'm having trouble understanding this statement (maybe (probably) just because I'm tired at the moment). This isn't the thread for that discussion, though, and I'm perfectly okay with a PM.
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This story didn't do much for me. The reason I got into Sci Fi when I was a teenager was to get away from romantic fiction, and find higher discussion of the human social condition beyond sex, love, religion and "finding my purpose in life". This story hit all those spots like a modern day soap opera - a form of entertainment I work very hard to avoid.
I understand that SF is about discussions of what our social situations will be like in the future, but this story was just too gratuitous and basic to forward any meaningful discussion for me.
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Yeah, I really liked this one. The flavouring idea was quite original and although the mention of the daughter gave us an idea of where it was heading, it didn't quite go that way.
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Someday, I'd be interested in hearing what "taking organized faith to its logical extremes" means. I'm having trouble understanding this statement (maybe (probably) just because I'm tired at the moment). This isn't the thread for that discussion, though, and I'm perfectly okay with a PM.
I tend to cause trouble by trying to economize words... but I'll risk it anyway, because I'm tired, too. (And if anyone wants to carry this off on a tangent, we should let Russell or another moderator know so we can have it split off.)
Basically, it doesn't seem to matter what anyone states as their belief, there is always someone willing to exaggerate that belief into a "logical extreme", usually in an attempt to show why that belief is absurd or to discredit the believer. In this story, the basic idea of "maybe we should try THIS way to reach God" was through over-indulgence; the author took it to the extreme to show that even though the intention was to find God, all that was accomplished was another brutally oppressive system was created that enriched some, exploited others, and left everyone generally feeling like something the cat dragged in.
In the real world, I often hear (from my family back home) the line "we want to live according to a strict, literal interpretation of the Bible". It sounds great to them, until they realize they would have to give up pork and shellfish and would have to stone most of the people they know (including me) to death. Facing that logical extreme, they tend to back down from their above-quoted line... though they seem pretty intent on getting other people to live according to their strict, literal interpretations sometimes.
And yes, we're going to visit them this summer, so I'm probably thinking too much about it. :)
Edit: I unquoted myself.
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As was pointed out by others, this servitude is slavery and rape, and clearly not Antonio's choice, but the Order seems to have rationalized that because they took him in and "gave him training and therapy" that this is some great favor, and something that he would have chosen to do.
Overall I enjoyed the story from just an "interesting thought" perspective of gene therapy modifying the various glands to produce an aphrodisiac. The social implications are also unique as though it might be slavery and rape and forced servitude etc. This only comes because this is your view of the definition of what's right and wrong. One of the things I enjoy about SF is the general willingness to look beyond one's current view of the universe and how its is defined and turn that on its head.
This is slavery and rape to us. To them it is a way for a family to get out of debt and destruction in a painful though respectful way. Antonio did have the opportunity to get out of his contract so society there does not apparently discriminate per example of the Chef once the Assininato (sp?) leaves their contract.
My main take is this is a story about a kid growing up and not seeing how good he has it. Yes the Countessa was extremely tiring and wore him out. He couldn't see the good he was doing for her and just couldn't look past the fact that he did have a purpose. It just wasn't what he wanted. It screams of a story about someone who is at the top of their profession and can't be happy about what they have. He's free now though by destroying his natural gifts.
As I was talking to my Significant Other about this story and her response was... "What? Too much sex for a man.. this must be Sci Fi."
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As was pointed out by others, this servitude is slavery and rape, and clearly not Antonio's choice, but the Order seems to have rationalized that because they took him in and "gave him training and therapy" that this is some great favor, and something that he would have chosen to do.
.... This only comes because this is your view of the definition of what's right and wrong. One of the things I enjoy about SF is the general willingness to look beyond one's current view of the universe and how its is defined and turn that on its head.
This is slavery and rape to us. To them it is a way for a family to get out of debt and destruction in a painful though respectful way.
I don't think of myself as a "moral absolutist", but ...
Webster's #1 definition for the verb rape (http://www.cs.chalmers.se/~hallgren/wget.cgi?rape) is: "to seize and take away by force", and for Slave it is (http://www.cs.chalmers.se/~hallgren/wget.cgi?slave): "a person held in servitude as the chattel of another."
So, it IS a case of slavery and rape. I guess what you're saying is "sometimes those things aren't so bad"? You could make a case for that, I suppose, but I think the story bears out my interpretation - namely, that rationalizing these behaviors in the name of religion doesn't prevent the spiritual damage that they cause.
As I was talking to my Significant Other about this story and her response was... "What? Too much sex for a man.. this must be Sci Fi."
I believe it's possible... I keep volunteering to be in the control group, too! ;)
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I am the lover. I am the chef. I am the preterite priest.
I am the secret, unknowable ingredient. You may taste me a thousand times, but never hold my essence on your tongue or capture it in your memory.
I am the flavor of ecstasy. Taste me and know God.
I am the Colonel's secret recipe.
Did anyone else notice that there wasn't a single moment of humor in this piece? It was relentlessly grim, and the main character seemed bored and detached, even when he was supposed to be feeling the first flush of love or cowering in fear. I'm not sure how you would write such a character without transferring that bored detachment onto the reader.
Cut the story to thirty minutes and throw in some gratuitous jello wrestling.
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As I was talking to my Significant Other about this story and her response was... "What? Too much sex for a man.. this must be Sci Fi."
I believe it's possible... I keep volunteering to be in the control group, too! ;)
Dude — the control group's the one with the normal level of whatever it is. The Experimental group on the other hand...
I am the lover. I am the chef. I am the preterite priest.
I am the secret, unknowable ingredient. You may taste me a thousand times, but never hold my essence on your tongue or capture it in your memory.
I am the flavor of ecstasy. Taste me and know God.
I am the Colonel's secret recipe.
Did anyone else notice that there wasn't a single moment of humor in this piece? It was relentlessly grim, and the main character seemed bored and detached, even when he was supposed to be feeling the first flush of love or cowering in fear. I'm not sure how you would write such a character without transferring that bored detachment onto the reader.
Cut the story to thirty minutes and throw in some gratuitous jello wrestling.
I didn't really feel a need for humor, and I'm not sure this narrator would have been capable of laughing. His emotions are certainly curtailed, and I don't think the emotionless can laugh in the same way someone else can. You can look at the evolutionary biological roots of laughter (http://www.wnyc.org/shows/radiolab/episodes/2008/02/22), which for the most part seems to have arisen as a "Don't worry, we're playing" signal. If you're emotionless like that and your only real pleasure is in properly preparing stuff but you have to do it or be killed/beaten/punished, I don't think you can really have fun. In fact, he spends so much time being bored I'm not sure he's even interested in anything else.
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Well... whatever I was expecting from Escape Pod this week, it wasn't that.
I agree to some extent with the comments that it was difficult to feel for any of the characters, but it was a necessary by-product of the story being told. And I thought it was fascinating to put an affectless character in the middle of so much frenzied, desperate sensuality. Antonio's inability to feel certain emotions and his consequent inability to empathize with the other characters drove the plot forward in a very natural way. And in the end I did feel some pity for this child-man trying to take control of his own destiny, unaware that he was lacking the skills to survive outside the controlled environment of the temple. I had a feeling that his character flaw was propelling the story towards a tragic end so I was relieved when it ended with some hope for Antonio's future.
So, not as much fun as a "typical" Escape Pod story (is there such a thing?) but I think the images from this one will stay with me longer than most, partly because the core ingredient of "chef as seasoning" is just so tasty. I have no objection to EP occasionally bending the rules for rewarding fare like this -- please keep on surprising us!
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More robots, less boners please.
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More robots, less boners please.
What about robots with boners?
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More robots, less boners please.
What about robots with boners?
Hmm...excellent question. I don't think it's called a boner on a robot (no bones). Although a real boner doesn't either, so I'm at a loss.
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Gah, I was ignoring this whole thread but I had to look into this. Some mammals actually do have a penile bone called a baculum, but that has nothing to do with the etymology of the word, apparantly. This link wasn't terribly illuminating, but gave me more information than I had before I found it.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=boner (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=boner)
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More robots, less boners please.
What about robots with boners?
I think there was one of those in Millennium (the John Varley novel). Its name was Sherman.
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This is the first EP episode that I didn't finish (to put in context, I have listened to about 50% of EP so far).
I didn't find the plot and character development strong enough to overcome the squick factor of the body eating sex. Since every listener will have a different squick threshold this is an extreme YMMV moment.
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This is the first EP episode that I didn't finish (to put in context, I have listened to about 50% of EP so far).
I didn't find the plot and character development strong enough to overcome the squick factor of the body eating sex. Since every listener will have a different squick threshold this is an extreme YMMV moment.
I think that would have bothered me if they had been eating him, instead of just tasting him. If he'd been given some kind of re-growing gene mod to allow that, then I would have been pushed more toward your "squick" factor.
But, as you say, that's a YMMV kinda thing.
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ok, well i liked the story, and i think that the story was... rightfuly grim?
i dont know, but the story was really like a memoir, something where you follow the person for a part of their life
the themes were intresting, and contrary so what some others said, i think that the hour was needed for character devleopment, and then change, so i liked it
its not the usual escapepod for sure, but not a bad one i think either
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I think that would have bothered me if they had been eating him, instead of just tasting him. If he'd been given some kind of re-growing gene mod to allow that, then I would have been pushed more toward your "squick" factor.
The episode "Eat Me" from the third season of Farscape comes to mind.
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Such a long, grim story with such spice (sorry). I loved the daughter's reaction and though disturbed by the beating, I was impressed that it was carried out. A living sex toy might be an acceptable compromise with a spouse in some circles, it would seem pretty icky to have your child share that toy. The religious journeys were an interesting side to the story that might have been added to raise the story above its bodice ripper profundity, but it seemed well developed. The process of genetic basting, if you'll forgive me, seemed bizarre, as did the process of cooking with your body.
I agree with comments above that knowing the chef was a "retired" Assasonier was disappointing. Maybe if a relative (like his father who gave him the cook book) had been it would have been okay.
I agree also that my reaction to the story would have been different if the main character was a woman.
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While I enjoyed the sensousness of the peice, the 'you better not mess with my daughter' plot point couldn't have been more obvious if Steve cranked that bit to 11. Part of me was anticipating the enventual meeting and downfall.
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Like Pressure, I found the distortion to human anatomy strangely disturbing. Both surprised me at the amount they made me uncomfortable. But as for the rest of the story, I just couldn't get into it. I lost interest pretty early on, fast-forwarded to the comments only to discover there were none. I did like Steve's commentary on Clarke, though, even though I can't say I've ever read anything by him (I usually say I like to read fantasy and watch sci-fi… about the only SF I've read that I got as absorbed as fantasy was the Dune series).
Yes, it reminded me of Pressure too, and made me wonder, which is more far-fetched, a man-fish, or a man-dish?
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Like Pressure, I found the distortion to human anatomy strangely disturbing. Both surprised me at the amount they made me uncomfortable. But as for the rest of the story, I just couldn't get into it. I lost interest pretty early on, fast-forwarded to the comments only to discover there were none. I did like Steve's commentary on Clarke, though, even though I can't say I've ever read anything by him (I usually say I like to read fantasy and watch sci-fi… about the only SF I've read that I got as absorbed as fantasy was the Dune series).
Yes, it reminded me of Pressure too, and made me wonder, which is more far-fetched, a man-fish, or a man-dish?
Edible people are nothing new. Example:
(http://web.mit.edu/fenway/www/Pictures/images/old-startrek-marathon-06-2.jpg)
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Edible people are nothing new. Example:
(http://web.mit.edu/fenway/www/Pictures/images/old-startrek-marathon-06-2.jpg)
Is that a cellular peptide cake with mint frosting?
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Is that a cellular peptide cake with mint frosting?
I loved Worf in that episode.
"With mint frosting!" is definitely his second best line after "Minsk!"
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Is that a cellular peptide cake with mint frosting?
I loved Worf in that episode.
"With mint frosting!" is definitely his second best line after "Minsk!"
Don't forget his great line "I AM NOT a merry man!"
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I just remembered it was the Troi cake that was cellular peptide with mint frosting.
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Is that a cellular peptide cake with mint frosting?
I loved Worf in that episode.
"With mint frosting!" is definitely his second best line after "Minsk!"
Don't forget his great line "I AM NOT a merry man!"
Yes, that is also in the top 5 :)
I eventually came to the conclusion that Worf had the finest sense of humour on the Enterprise, and was continually making up shit about Klingon culture, just to see what he could get people to believe. For example, when he's telling Wes about males reading love poetry to win mates, and is asked "what do the females do?", his response "They throw rocks" is hilarious.
I have many over-thought theories about Star Trek. For example, did you know that Jean-Luc Picard enrolled in Star Fleet under a false name?
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Edible people are nothing new. Example:
(http://web.mit.edu/fenway/www/Pictures/images/old-startrek-marathon-06-2.jpg)
Isn't that Data? Is he a "people"?
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Isn't that Data? Is he a "people"?
According to Measure of a Man, yes.
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Isn't that Data? Is he a "people"?
According to Measure of a Man, yes.
I consider Data to be a "people". SPOILER (and embarrassment coverage): I never cry when vacuum cleaners and electronics "die". :'(
But, my favorite Worf line (because it comes in handy all the time) was from the baseball episode of DS9; when Sisko calls for some chatter, and Worf bellows, "Death to the opposition!"
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Isn't that Data? Is he a "people"?
According to Measure of a Man, yes.
I consider Data to be a "people". SPOILER (and embarrassment coverage): I never cry when vacuum cleaners and electronics "die". :'(
But, my favorite Worf line (because it comes in handy all the time) was from the baseball episode of DS9; when Sisko calls for some chatter, and Worf bellows, "Death to the opposition!"
LOL
I had forgotten that line. And it's one of my favourite episodes of any flavour of Star Trek, too.
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I could have sworn I had replied to this thread already, but my post history says otherwise...
I had to read the preview to figure out that Steve was saying "assaisonment," but in retrospect his pronuncation was decent; I guess I just wasn't expecting to hear the word. But, as it means "seasoning," it's a great term for these people.
I was blown away by this story while I was listening to it. Strangely though, I'm not sure I would count it as one of my favorite EP episodes--but it was a very good listen. The story had a good flow to it, and the concept was rather fascinating.
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I enjoyed this storey. It gave a new take on the link between food and sex as well as what happens when some is given too much time alone.
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Hmm... I both liked and disliked this story. I knew this was SF from the moment that he willed himself to have an erection and it worked! :)
The Good: The flavored people is an interesting idea. A future religion that modifies humans into sex-slaves to find God through gluttony and lust is an interesting take (and disturbing). Well-written.
The sex-slavery is particularly disturbing and effective. And the fact that the religion, which supposedly believes in finding God through orgasms (and food) deprives their own priests of the ability to orgasm.
The Bad:
Call me a prude, but in general I just don't see that much appeal in mixing sex and food. Particularly when he rubbed the raw chicken on his body, and it had already mentioned that he doesn't bathe, I threw up in my mouth a little. And throughout the whole thing, I just kept thinking "Now I know where the special sauce comes from! Ew!"
I groaned when he arrived and the father explained to him the daughter was off-limits. Not that it's not reasonable, but isn't there an old cliched plot where a traveler stops by a farmhouse looking for room and board. The benevolent father gives him a room and board in exchange for helping out on the farm, but he has a beautiful daughter (often a virgin) who wants nothing more than to have sex with him? I know I've seen it a million times, but the only two instances I can think of are an episode of Seinfeld and a chapter of the first Wheel of Time book.
The reveal about the other chef being a former food-monk came out of nowhere and then never actually was addressed other than the chef's single-line reveal.
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It's actually one of the oldest formula jokes around. "The traveling salesman and the farmer's daughter" is a staple of bad jokes and bad porn alike.
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I groaned when he arrived and the father explained to him the daughter was off-limits. Not that it's not reasonable, but isn't there an old cliched plot where a traveler stops by a farmhouse looking for room and board. The benevolent father gives him a room and board in exchange for helping out on the farm, but he has a beautiful daughter (often a virgin) who wants nothing more than to have sex with him? I know I've seen it a million times, but the only two instances I can think of are an episode of Seinfeld and a chapter of the first Wheel of Time book.
The oldest example I can think of is The Reeve's Tale, one of Chaucer's Canterbury tales. And, since I think the belief is that Chaucer mainly adapter existing tales rather than create them from scratch, that means this trope was familiar already at the 14th century.
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I groaned when he arrived and the father explained to him the daughter was off-limits. Not that it's not reasonable, but isn't there an old cliched plot where a traveler stops by a farmhouse looking for room and board. The benevolent father gives him a room and board in exchange for helping out on the farm, but he has a beautiful daughter (often a virgin) who wants nothing more than to have sex with him? I know I've seen it a million times, but the only two instances I can think of are an episode of Seinfeld and a chapter of the first Wheel of Time book.
The oldest example I can think of is The Reeve's Tale, one of Chaucer's Canterbury tales. And, since I think the belief is that Chaucer mainly adapter existing tales rather than create them from scratch, that means this trope was familiar already at the 14th century.
Oh yeah! I remember that one. It involved a very memorable kiss if I do recall. Anyway, it's a situation that's been so overdone over the years that I find it hard to take it seriously anymore.