Escape Artists

Escape Pod => Episode Comments => Topic started by: Russell Nash on June 06, 2008, 09:50:44 AM

Title: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Russell Nash on June 06, 2008, 09:50:44 AM
EP161: Alien Promises (http://escapepod.org/2008/06/06/ep161-alien-promises/)

By By Janni Lee Simner (http://www.simner.com/).
Read by Anna Eley.
First appeared in Bruce Coville’s Book of Aliens II (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0590852930?ie=UTF8&tag=escapepod-20&creativeASIN=0590852930/), ed. Bruce Coville.

Jenny was silent for a while. “Promise me something?” she finally asked. “If they ever come for you, promise you’ll let me know?”

“Why?” I had trouble believing Jenny really wanted to leave. Maybe this was all some sort of joke.

“Just promise,” Jenny said.

“No.” Even if she was serious, Jenny was the last person I wanted following me into space.

Jenny took a deep breath. “I’ll tell you, too. If they ever come for me.”


Rated G. This is a young adult SF story.


Referenced Sites:
Secret of the Three Treasures (http://www.amazon.com/Secret-Three-Treasures-Janni-Simner/dp/0823419142/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212729420&sr=1-7) by Janni Lee Simner
Bones of Faerie (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0375845631?ie=UTF8&tag=escapepod-20&creativeASIN=0375845631) by Janni Lee Simner
Tale Chasing - Urban Fantasy podcast (http://talechasing.com/)


(http://escapepod.org/wp-images/podcast-mini4.gif)
Listen to this week’s Escape Pod! (http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP161_AlienPromises.mp3)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Sylvan on June 06, 2008, 12:17:47 PM
I wouldn't have been so kind.  That sort of knowledge about yourself is unsettling and sobering.  No matter where such realization comes from, it's important that it does.  In this case, that I would be more petty and shallow than someone I resemble, came in "Alien Promises".

"Juvenile fiction" may be the bookshelf classification for Ms. Simner's work but I want to make it clear that I don't think something that could impact a 40-year old man this deeply should be pigeon-holed.  I haven't felt many deep emotions in my life for a long time.  I think that's the way things are for many of us.  We are passionate in our teens and young adult years but, as time goes on, something fades.  This story helped rekindle some of that in me.

I never made that promise but I did stare at the stars wishing for the aliens to come.  When I was a kid, there was even a TV show called "Project Blue Book":  all about alien encounters.  To me, this wasn't fiction:  it was reality waiting to happen.  I really believed, strongly, that the aliens were here, they were benevolent, and -if I was very, very lucky- they would come to take me with them.

"Alien Promises", as Steve covered in his outro, is about community and not feeling alone.  And yes, Steve, you're right.  These days, thanks in no small part to the Internet, I have those acquaintances.  I belong to that network.

The story itself, I was very afraid, was going to go in the direction of the Mercedes Lackey song "Rejected".  If you don't know it, hunt it down.  The rendition I own was sung by Heather Alexander.  It, too, is deeply moving for different reasons and with a very different outcome.  In many ways, this is the bookend interpretation of the people-meeting-aliens scenario.

I was also impressed by the way Jenny was shown with some depth; that real understanding on a very common point could bridge those gaps.  This is the part that made me realize I would not be as kind.  Had I written this tale, the mean little girl would have gotten her comeuppance and no one from the popular cliques would be portrayed as having feelings.  Well, that would be my initial inclination...  How refreshing to have something different!

How uplifting!

There were a couple points in which my mind was pulled out of the story by the dialogue (it sometimes seemed too "young" for a girl of 15 years, towards the end) but if that's my only critique it's a pretty limited one.

So, as I sit here after a powerful set of storms came whipping through the Twin Cities last night, does anyone else want to help me build a spaceship?

Yours,
Sylvan (Dave)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Listener on June 06, 2008, 01:47:49 PM
The voice of the main character as she narrated was captured well by the reader.

My biggest problem with the story was that, when Courtney was yelling up to the alien ship, everyone else was just standing around.  You'd think someone would've gotten mad at her for saying she deserved to go, that the aliens came for her above all others.  The other people were surprisingly well-behaved.

My other problem is more personal, and is not really related to the story as such except in that it made me think about this:

While I fully approve of the way the Promisers were going to build their own spaceship, as a person who works in news I'm forced to deal with the gritty realism that private space ventures (and non-NASA ventures, such as the Russian and Chinese space programs) will continue to be met with derision by the media, which controls what most people think.  (Not the people on this forum.  We're not most people.)  When I was a kid, I thought someday I could be an astronaut.  Now I know you either have to be rich, an awesomely-smart scientist, or a member of the US military to get up there.  And if you're lucky, you'll be able to use the toilet.  I'm just ground down on the whole common-people-in-space-in-my-lifetime idea, and that part of the denouement bothered me.

Overall, though, I would give the story a solid middle-of-the-road seal of mild approval.  Liked it more than Kalakkak's Cousins, didn't like it more than Friction.  When I heard it was going to be a YA story (my coworker got Steve's tweet on Tuesday), I was worried it would be another Squonk (forgive me, but I just don't like the Squonk stories) and was thankful that it wasn't.

Great title, by the way.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Void Munashii on June 06, 2008, 03:01:28 PM
  While not a fantastic story, it was very good. Anna's voice was perfect for this story, and I think really captured the character perfectly.

  For a story meant for "young adults" this story was very deep, and actually a little sad. Having been a geek and a loner myself (go figure, right?), I could identify easily with her, and with her surprise that her enemy had something so important in common with her. It's important for young geeks and nerds to realize they are not alone, and that there are others out there who feel the same way; I think the internet helps with that a lot now, and sort of wish that it had been available to me when I was in school.

  I found the speaker to be totally beleivable. The duty she felt to keep her promise, the selfishness displayed when she told to aliens to leave all the others behind, the deep sadness she felt, and continues to feel, when the aliens leave her behind; these all show a really well developed character for such a short piece.

  There may be aspects to the number of people who showed up for the ship (clearly some people had made this promise with more than just 2 other people), but if I am willing to accept an alien spaceship landing on a beach and a group of people who could easily turn into the next Heaven's Gate trying to build their own ship, then I should be able to accept the rest of it as well. This just doesn't seem like a story to pick apart to me.

  One thing that seems to show some real depth and thought in this story is the fact that even when the speaker discovers she is not alone in her desire to leave Earth behind she is still sad, and in some way still alone. Even as part of a group she still cries for the opportunity she lost. The problem isn't that she was really alone, although it sounds like she was, it's that she alone inside, and that is why lonliness can never be stamped out. Sometimes loneliness comes from the inside, and there's not always anything that can be done about it. Even if these people leave Earth they will not feel whole; they will continue to feel alone because the problem is not Earth, it's them.

  The true moral of this story seems to be a simple one to me; don't make promises. If you don't make promises then you are not honour bound to keep them. That said, I do promise that if the aliens come for me, and I am able to do so, I will let you all know  ;D
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: DKT on June 06, 2008, 04:03:37 PM
What a lovely little surprise of a story.  I don't know if I was more caught off guard by its optimism, or the fact that I wanted to throw my arms around its optimistic approach. 

Good way to start a Friday.  Thanks for this!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 06, 2008, 04:39:03 PM
My biggest problem with the story was that, when Courtney was yelling up to the alien ship, everyone else was just standing around.  You'd think someone would've gotten mad at her for saying she deserved to go, that the aliens came for her above all others.  The other people were surprisingly well-behaved.
Yeah, I rationalised that away by thinking that her outbursts were really just her thinking it, and thinking that she'd said it, and everyone else was doing something similar.

I think it would be a decent way for an alien species to kick-start a push to space. It's certainly an alien way of doing it. anyway.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: lieffeil on June 06, 2008, 06:12:35 PM
Now that's what I'm talking about.
I was worried, when Steve mentioned that it was a YA story, thinking that it might run along the same lines as 143, Flaming Marshmallows. Fun, but not a realistic or particularly pleasant portrayal of young girls. Some people seem to think that they hit eighteen and all of a sudden they could think clearly, for the first time. Anything they'd experienced in those first 19 years  had been, well, frivolous.
I was pleasantly surprised. Good choice.
That being said, the story didn't catch me so much through the plot as through the reading. The line "It takes a lot of people to build a space ship," was delivered with such frank, wide-eyed sincerity that I actually giggled. And I'm not a giggly person.
So, well done to Anna.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: contra on June 06, 2008, 09:24:56 PM
I liked the story.  I remember being that young and I would have made that deal... as Steve said... I think I still would...


But the main thing that got me at the end is that it sounded like the beginings of a cult...
And from such I nice story, my mind goes straight to the darkness of what could happen....
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: deflective on June 06, 2008, 11:29:12 PM
My biggest problem with the story was that, when Courtney was yelling up to the alien ship, everyone else was just standing around.  You'd think someone would've gotten mad at her for saying she deserved to go, that the aliens came for her above all others.  The other people were surprisingly well-behaved.
Yeah, I rationalised that away by thinking that her outbursts were really just her thinking it, and thinking that she'd said it, and everyone else was doing something similar.

i like to think that they understood where she was coming from. everyone wanted the same thing she wanted, everyone would have an idea what it would be to lose your personal ride because you tried to share it.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Chivalrybean on June 06, 2008, 11:45:41 PM
I agree with Steve that there are several problems with the plot, but I also agree that I really don't care. It was all about the people. I liked the people. I can relate with the people. I'm reminded of Signs and all the people who hated it for the reasons of the aliens. I didn't care about the aliens, I cared about the people who had to deal with the aliens. Why did I like Iron Man a lot? Because I got to see Tony Stark change, not because there were explosions.

I really think the story tells us this truth: We are not alone, and I don't mean the aliens. Humans are built to be social creatures and want to find a group of people I fit in with. There is a huge problem with the world, or at least America, in which so many people are self-contained. The problem is, life isn't any fun, or very productive like that. Having been of the end of having very few friends, this story is a good reminder that all I have to do is look to find them, and make a little effort to get to know them.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: DarkKnightJRK on June 07, 2008, 09:46:46 AM
I remember that the first thing I wanted to be when I grow up was to be an astronaut, in-between being a archeologist, a pro-basketball player and a dinosaur hunter--as you can see, I had high aspirations. I was definately one of those kids that looked up at the skies and want to explore them. So, needless to say, I definately related to, and was moved by this story.

I espicially liked how our nerdy main character's wishes to go into space with the aliens was shared by the popular girl. There's something about growing up that we forget that we all had that same wide-eyed wonder about the world around us and the potential of what we could find just around the corner. While I may have openly read a lot of sci-fi and openly expressed my love for it, I know that even in the most meatheaded of the jocks there is if only a faint solidarity. Like Steve said in this, "We are not alone."

While I fully approve of the way the Promisers were going to build their own spaceship, as a person who works in news I'm forced to deal with the gritty realism that private space ventures (and non-NASA ventures, such as the Russian and Chinese space programs) will continue to be met with derision by the media, which controls what most people think.  (Not the people on this forum.  We're not most people.)  When I was a kid, I thought someday I could be an astronaut.  Now I know you either have to be rich, an awesomely-smart scientist, or a member of the US military to get up there.  And if you're lucky, you'll be able to use the toilet.  I'm just ground down on the whole common-people-in-space-in-my-lifetime idea, and that part of the denouement bothered me.

That reminds me--have you seen The Astronaut Farmer, starring Billy Bob Thorton? It has a similar premise--about a guy who tries to build his own rocket so that he can orbit the Earth, and the complications that come from NASA, media, and his family coping with it all. It's a VERY good story in the same vein of opening up that childhood wonder.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: cuddlebug on June 07, 2008, 10:25:05 AM
Ok, seriously, I will be so disappointed if you go and leave me behind, please send me a message when they come for you. … and yes, I’ll help build OUR spaceship, IF I can be of help, that is. I am sure I can help with design issues, we can hang some paintings, or I can come up with a colour scheme, not sure that kind of thing will be a priority  :)

"Juvenile fiction" may be the bookshelf classification for Ms. Simner's work but I want to make it clear that I don't think something that could impact a 40-year old man this deeply should be pigeon-holed.  I haven't felt many deep emotions in my life for a long time.  I think that's the way things are for many of us.  We are passionate in our teens and young adult years but, as time goes on, something fades.  This story helped rekindle some of that in me.
Yours,
Sylvan (Dave)

I completely agree with you there, classifying this story as ‘young adult fiction’ to my mind is slightly beside the point, for it is clearly targeting at an audience that is very likely to have experienced similar things in their life, no matter what age. Too bad though that the realization “we are not as different as we think” comes much later in life. Thinking back now, when I was a teenager I didn’t know anyone with similar interests and passions, but now I know I might have passed people by, sat next to kids who did in fact share these passions, but social restraints, stereotypes, …whatever…  kept us from finding out. Sounds sad, but I think that is our reality. It takes a lot of effort and time to get to know people, we don’t want to force ourselves on others and will remain at a stage where we think of someone as a “jock”, never knowing that “jock” might have just read one of our favorite books.

The social retreat and solitude that some teenagers seek is a very dangerous phenomenon IMO, for especially teenagers and children need social interaction to find their place in society, as someone else has mentioned before, human beings are not ‘islands’, we need other people. This reminded me very strongly of Hikikomori (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/correspondent/2334893.stm) (extreme agoraphobia as a social phenomenon amongst Japanese teenagers, who never leave their home and don’t communicate with anyone. I listened to something about that on the BBC4 Thinking Allowed podcast.)

And Sylvan, it made me sad to read that the 'passion' in your life has faded … see my experience is very different, I have never been as passionate as I am now. As a teenager I was so occupied with figuring things out, finding my place, … so that my ‘passions’ were a bit all over the place and it took me a long time to figure out my priorities. Now that I am in my thirties I KNOW who I am and what I like, I know what makes me tick and I am very passionate about a lot of things. The problem is, that as a teenager it is much more accepted that one is enthusiastic and passionate about things, when adults act like that, they are often considered immature.

Ok, to summarize, a great story and perfect for this audience, for most of us can somewhat identify with it.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Enigma K on June 07, 2008, 09:17:10 PM
I'm not sure how much I agree that the other promised people would be angry.  This main character was the one approached by the aliens.  The others were all latching on, and should have known it.

Stories like this are why I keep playing the Escape Pod before Podcastle or Pseudopod.  People do things

The characters in Alien Promises addressed their problems and acted to make their lives better.  This is something I find to be very lacking in almost all entertainment these days, and more than enough of a recurring theme in Escape Pod to keep me coming back regularly.

I thought the bulk of this was well-written.  The description of the bully's home life was very impressive, in that it described her problems plainly without dwelling on the obvious or miserable.  Even the way she handled the loneliness always felt hopeful instead of crushing or overbearing.  Hope was a second and unnamed theme to the entire piece.

I really appreciated this story.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Planish on June 08, 2008, 02:07:36 PM
[me] "Hi. I'm John. I'm a Reader. I've been book-free for two days"
[others, in unison] "Hello John."

So, did the aliens take anybody with them? It doesn't sound like they did. If not, then why did they bother to show up? They say "Yes, you're the one we came for". Then they pat her on the head and say "You are not alone", which in her mind evades the issue (of who they should take).

Whatever.

I found the story engaging, even though I guessed early on that the ending was probably going to be one of a limited number of outcomes, much like an episode of Buffy The Vampire Slayer.

Casting for the animated feature film:
(http://www.aa.e-mansion.com/~rydeen/Resources/Violet9785-200.jpg)
(Violet "invisible girl" Parr)

Movie sequel: October Sky (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0132477/)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: eytanz on June 08, 2008, 03:11:14 PM
[me] "Hi. I'm John. I'm a Reader. I've been book-free for two days"
[others, in unison] "Hello John."

So, did the aliens take anybody with them? It doesn't sound like they did. If not, then why did they bother to show up? They say "Yes, you're the one we came for". Then they pat her on the head and say "You are not alone", which in her mind evades the issue (of who they should take).

Whatever.

I think the aliens were part of the Valuable-Lesson fleet of the Interstellar Alliance of Sentient Races and Thin Metaphors, or something like that. They probably never planned to take anyone with them, they just pop around the galaxy teaching socially awkward teenagers that they are not alone. Otherwise, why did they make her wait until dawn? :)

Kidding aside, I enjoyed this story. It was very well written, and engaging. Though while I remember being twelve well enough to not find the story implausible in the way Steve mentions, I guess I don't remember it well enough to connect. Or maybe it's just because, even as a kid, change always scared me more than loneliness, so I would have much rather stayed somewhere I was unhappy but knew exactly what to expect then risk going somewhere where things may be different in all sorts of unexpected ways.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Tango Alpha Delta on June 08, 2008, 08:20:05 PM
Quote from: Steve
"In an almost literal sense, [making that promise is] what I've been doing this past few years."

"It's a collective shout that 'You are not alone.'"

Ex-ACT-ly right.  That's why I've been so excited about what Steve is doing with Escape Artists, and why I'm so pleased to see it succeeding.  (And once two more irritating financial hurdles are ... um... hurdled, I'll be able to put my money where my virtual mouth is on this!)

This is also what motivated me to write my first submission to Escape Pod, Upstairs (http://tadshappyfuntime.blogspot.com/2007/04/upstairs.html) (which was rightfully rejected); that deep-rooted, childhood wish that we could go "out there" and that all of these crazy, fantastic ideas we enjoy as entertainment might just be true.

It's sad, but necessary, that we have to learn to accept that some things are impossible; but that just means it's that much more important that we work on bringing the things that are plausible into reality.

Maybe there aren't any aliens out there waiting for us (maybe there are?)... but building that ship is no less important.  And I promise, if I find out anything about it, I'm telling you.  :)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Josh on June 08, 2008, 10:03:50 PM
Wheel of morality turn turn turn, tell us a lesson that we should learn.

I just felt that it was so swollen with morals that there was not enough space for good storyline.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 09, 2008, 12:32:49 PM
So, did the aliens take anybody with them? It doesn't sound like they did. If not, then why did they bother to show up? They say "Yes, you're the one we came for". Then they pat her on the head and say "You are not alone", which in her mind evades the issue (of who they should take).
My guess is that it was some inscrutably alien way of kick-starting Earth's space programme. Figure out the webs of trust amongst socially awkward teenagers, visit a carefully chosen few, and give them time to get the word out, and leave them to build their own space ships. If they manage to get something that even takes off without killing its passengers, then that inspires other groups to do the same, and eventually you have a grassroots space programme setting off for Wolf 359!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Corydon on June 09, 2008, 06:22:14 PM
Ugh.  This story is in the worst tradition of YA fiction: the after-school special, in which the protagonist Learns a Valuable Lesson.  Even as a kid, I was suspicious of that sort of thing; as an adult, I really can't stand it.  Not a fan of this one.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: birdless on June 09, 2008, 09:29:34 PM
The best thing about this story for me was the reading. It was the first one I'd heard Anna read.

I enjoyed the story, especially the point that "we are not alone," but in the end, I felt betrayed by the character's selfishness. Suddenly my compassion and empathy for her were stung by this self-centered, self-absorbed, uncaring attitude. I can plainly remember when I drifted into the age where the social divides began to segregate me into the isolation of the offbeat. But even as a teenager, I wouldn't have assumed that this huge crowd of people were somehow less worthy than myself to accompany these aliens. It would have been heartbreaking to be left, especially since I was the original recipient of the alien offer, but that would have only made it only marginally less painful (if at all) for all the others who would had been left behind. Maybe the love of my family and the few friends I did have put me in a position where it's hard for me to relate to this girl. But for me, I was just a little taken aback at the selfishness she displayed in the denouement.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Planish on June 10, 2008, 12:26:56 AM
It's sad, but necessary, that we have to learn to accept that some things are impossible; but that just means it's that much more important that we work on bringing the things that are plausible into reality.
*rocking chair creak*
I used to watch TV shows (black and white, of course) about science and whatnot, dealing with things that seemed impossibly far in the future. You know, stuff like rockets to the moon, powerful computers, extremely miniaturized electronics, lasers, robots, materials with exotic properties, etc. By golly, they've happened, and in my lifetime.
If you had tried to tell me that my future job would involve satellite communications and computers, and that I would own pocket-sized portable phones, lasers, and computers that could be connected to a world-wide network, I'd have said "No way!". (Except that "no way" was not a common expression back then.)

Meanwhile, I had SF literature, to live that future life vicariously. I'm sure it's no coincidence that this place is called "Escape Pod".
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: stePH on June 10, 2008, 05:08:29 AM
The best thing about this story for me was the reading. It was the first one I'd heard Anna read.

Anna really enchanted me with her reading of the flash piece "Wetting the Bed" quite some time ago (can't be arsed to look up exactly when that story was run.)  This one ... a bit less so.

Not a great story, not a bad one.  I don't regret the time spent listening to it.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: qwints on June 10, 2008, 08:01:05 AM
 I liked the story for what it was. I'm glad the popular bully didn't up being a victim of abuse at home or have some other simple and easy explanation for her hostility. That and the main character's selfishness drove it away from being an after school special.

On another note, this story seemed to be the exact opposite of my favorite s.f. story as a young adult : Ender's Game. I loved the story of the kid who everyone messed with, but who succeeded anyway. That said, I've come to be uncomfortable with the morality of that story. Ender's extreme violence is always justified by the author. It was nice that this story catered to nicer instincts.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Rain on June 10, 2008, 01:30:01 PM
I think Anna did a good job with the Squonk the Dragon stories but this time it seems she forgot to leave the kids accent behind (i assume she talks in that voice on purpose), some of the words were hard to understand  and it general it just didnt work for me.

The story was... very bad, near the end after the aliens left i guessed what was about to happend and i litterally cringed as what has been a forgettable/bad story turned even worse.
I found the story to be very unbelivable, our main characters gets beaten up regularly by this girl Jenny, but since her tormentor belives in aliens too everything is suddenly ok? We never get a reason why she would call Jenny (a person she doesnt know and doesnt like) after all those years, oh wait, apparanly reading a lot makes words mean more! The aliens in the story served no purpose, i assume they were only there to give the story about how the nerdy girl got some friends a sci-fi twist.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Listener on June 10, 2008, 01:40:26 PM
Ugh.  This story is in the worst tradition of YA fiction: the after-school special, in which the protagonist Learns a Valuable Lesson.  Even as a kid, I was suspicious of that sort of thing; as an adult, I really can't stand it.  Not a fan of this one.

That was one of the things I purposefully overlooked because of the intended audience -- the author wrote it for a YA audience, so it had the YA sensibilities.  If, as a YA, you wouldn't have liked the story, I'm fine with that.  But as an adult reading a YA story, although I know great YA fiction doesn't NEED such things (witness "The Golden Compass" and the first three or so Harry Potters), a lot of YA still has the Valuable Lesson and I just let it pass.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 10, 2008, 01:45:09 PM
It wasn't that I didn't like this story, but more it was so savagely mediocre I'm surprised it made it past the Eley suitability screening process.  Ditto on the parable element Corydon!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Corydon on June 10, 2008, 05:11:14 PM
That was one of the things I purposefully overlooked because of the intended audience -- the author wrote it for a YA audience, so it had the YA sensibilities.  If, as a YA, you wouldn't have liked the story, I'm fine with that.  But as an adult reading a YA story, although I know great YA fiction doesn't NEED such things (witness "The Golden Compass" and the first three or so Harry Potters), a lot of YA still has the Valuable Lesson and I just let it pass.

Yeah, I recognize that lots of YA fiction features Important Messages.  But I see that as a weakness, and a characteristic of bad YA-- kids don't need to be preached to any more than adults do-- so I'm not willing to let it pass.

Really, I thought that eytanz's description was spot-on, and made me laugh:

Quote
I think the aliens were part of the Valuable-Lesson fleet of the Interstellar Alliance of Sentient Races and Thin Metaphors, or something like that. They probably never planned to take anyone with them, they just pop around the galaxy teaching socially awkward teenagers that they are not alone.

But he's more generous than I am...
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Kaa on June 10, 2008, 07:11:58 PM
This is exactly the kind of story that I love.  Not only was it well written, it was exceptionally read by Anna.  Her reading reminded me strongly of the audio version of The Lovely Bones by Alice Sebold. Not the story, just the reading.  Brava.

This story touched a very deep place in me.  I'm another one who used to look up at the night sky and...I don't think I ever really articulated, even to myself, that I wanted to be among the stars, but I did.  I still do.  Like Steve, I'd make the same promise today.

As an aside, I think labeling stories as "YA" does them a disservice when there are people who react with that typical knee-jerk reaction to it.  For instance, I read Lois Lowry's The Giver without knowing it was a YA story, and it remains one of my favorite books I've read in the last five years.  I think adults can get a lot out of stories even if they're aimed at a younger audience, and this story shows that quite well, as demonstrated by how many of us enjoyed it.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Ocicat on June 10, 2008, 08:19:48 PM
This one was nice enough, but didn't really touch me.  As messages go - it's one I got a long, long time ago.  I was the kid in elementary school who was busy bringing all the nerds and geeks together and making a group out of us.  Still doing it, actually - this weekend I threw a party with 100 or so of my closest friends, mostly folks who I met at science fiction conventions over the years, or other places for people who don't fit in well with the mainstream.  Helping to build that community is one of the most important things in my life.  So a applaud the story, despite it's unrealistic points, I just don't need it, personally.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 11, 2008, 09:22:32 AM
Quote
This is exactly the kind of story that I love.  Not only was it well written, it was exceptionally read by Anna.  Her reading reminded me strongly of the audio version of The Lovely Bones by Alice Sebold. Not the story, just the reading.  Brava.

I try not to make judgements on a story based on the reading, although sometimes it is a difficult thing to do.  If an author is lucky enough to have their story read by a fitting or accomplised orator, it can lend fathoms to its delivery and reception.  Connie Maybe, read sometime ago by Wichita Rutherford is a classic example of a perfect moulding, and for that reason remains one of my favourite EP stories to date. I'm gripped with side splitting fits of laughter whenever I listen to it.  Conversely I have been disconcerted on a few other  occasions (and really only a few) because of the ineptitued of the vocal delivery... which is really no fault of the author's.  I'm not being critical of EP here.  In fact they do an excpeptional job in the delivery of audio content such as no other podcast I have yet encountered.  Neither am I saying that the reading should not be taken in to consideration when evaluating an episode; certainly Anna's reading was superb, and does deserve a mention, but strictly speaking remains a seperate component from the merits of the story as opposed to those attributed to the author.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Jhite on June 11, 2008, 03:13:47 PM
I was not in love with this story.  It was alright, it just didn't do much for me.  I was not a big reader of YA fiction even as a kid, and now really can't get into it at all.

Sorry Steve, I will have to vote for no more YA Fiction on Escape pod, if there is a voting going on, Which I don't think there is.  As one of my former bosses was famous for saying, "I don't think you understand, this is not a democracy. I am in charge." 



Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: SamChupp on June 11, 2008, 04:34:34 PM
I really liked this story - it touched me very deeply.

I have made similar promises.

The funny thing is, I have also made promises of this kind to pick up folks if the Faeries come for me.

Or if I fall into an alternate fantasy world where magic works and I could become my favorite D&D character.

This story has that same wistfulness which made me nearly tear up and cry.

Anna's voice was perfect.

This story is about that sense of "Old Friends Who Just Met" which is prevalent in fandom, and I love these kind of stories.

I particularly loved the line "And when it lands, we'll be the aliens. All of us, together."

If we can't have YA fiction on Escape Pod, maybe you need to make TeenPod or something. Because this is cool.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: stePH on June 11, 2008, 05:15:14 PM
If we can't have YA fiction on Escape Pod, maybe you need to make TeenPod or something. Because this is cool.

There's always Clonepod.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: FNH on June 11, 2008, 07:47:25 PM
Nice story, excellent reading!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Swamp on June 11, 2008, 10:01:13 PM
Wheel of morality turn turn turn, tell us a lesson that we should learn.

I just felt that it was so swollen with morals that there was not enough space for good storyline.
Ugh.  This story is in the worst tradition of YA fiction: the after-school special, in which the protagonist Learns a Valuable Lesson.  Even as a kid, I was suspicious of that sort of thing; as an adult, I really can't stand it.  Not a fan of this one.
Yeah, I recognize that lots of YA fiction features Important Messages.  But I see that as a weakness, and a characteristic of bad YA-- kids don't need to be preached to any more than adults do-- so I'm not willing to let it pass.

I have to respectfully disagree with the sentiments stated here, although I relate to where they come from.  Kids and adults both need to be taught the importance of values and morals.  Honesty, Honoring your Word,  Sincere care for others, Integrity, Respect--these are important things.

I'm not saying this story is a model of how it should be done.  I share the desire to role your eyes at heavy handed "afterschool special" type lessons.  I giggle sometimes when I watch old sitcoms like "Different Strokes", "Facts of Life", or "Family Ties", but at the same time I really miss those shows and their attempt to teach me something.  As a young adult, I actually got some "valuable lessons" from those characters.  Now sitcoms are a sea of recycled sex jokes.  Yes, I may laugh, but is that really all there is to life.

I did like this story, mostly for the realness of the protagonist and her emotions.  Adolescent bonding based on shared desire to flee with aliens may be a stretch, but as others said, I didn't care.  It was engaging enough to enjoy.

Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 12, 2008, 03:05:36 AM
Quote
I have to respectfully disagree with the sentiments stated here, although I relate to where they come from.  Kids and adults both need to be taught the importance of values and morals.  Honesty, Honoring your Word,  Sincere care for others, Integrity, Respect--these are important things


I disagree further still. I don't have an issue with YA or stories with morals per se.  Done with any reasonable degree of tact when manipulated into a storyline it's fine.  I expect half the stories I've read have some kind of mild ethical motive lurking in he prose, even when it hasn't been deliberately intended.  What I didn't like about this story was the way it was done.  The whole story seemed shrouded in the intent to provide some sort of ethical epiphany.  It wasn't even subtle, and left me feeling like I'd just watched Bambi.  Perhaps in my prepubescent days I would have enjoyed this one, but as a young adult when I already thought I 'knew it all'... I would probably have been outraged by this condescension. 
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: CammoBlammo on June 12, 2008, 10:07:10 AM
I was about halfway through listening to the story when I decided that while good, it might have been a little clichéd for my taste. You know the thing --- lonesome kid who feels alone in the world, a bully who was probably just as lonely, Anna's voice and so on. Then I realised I didn't mind the clichés at all, because the story was taking me along. So I decided that those things are tropes of a pre-emoish subgenre of Young Adult.

I don't know if there's a better word for it. But given that this is not a democracy, I'll just say it is and wait for the police to arrive.

(Or aliens. Aliens would be so cool!)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Corydon on June 12, 2008, 01:42:40 PM
Quote
I have to respectfully disagree with the sentiments stated here, although I relate to where they come from.  Kids and adults both need to be taught the importance of values and morals.  Honesty, Honoring your Word,  Sincere care for others, Integrity, Respect--these are important things


I disagree further still. I don't have an issue with YA or stories with morals per se.  Done with any reasonable degree of tact when manipulated into a storyline it's fine.  I expect half the stories I've read have some kind of mild ethical motive lurking in he prose, even when it hasn't been deliberately intended.  What I didn't like about this story was the way it was done.  The whole story seemed shrouded in the intent to provide some sort of ethical epiphany.  It wasn't even subtle, and left me feeling like I'd just watched Bambi.  Perhaps in my prepubescent days I would have enjoyed this one, but as a young adult when I already thought I 'knew it all'... I would probably have been outraged by this condescension. 

I agree with what you're saying, but think you're being unfair to Bambi.  If after Bambi's mother died, he had a monologue all about how hunting is bad, m'kay?, then it'd be a more fair comparison to this story.  The movie does have a lot to say about loss, and about the pain of growing up.  But it makes its point without beating its audience around the head.  That's why it's still worth watching, and all those after-school specials aren't.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 12, 2008, 03:01:53 PM
LOL< yes, you're quite right!  Don't take me too literally, I do believe I have exaggerated somewhat to make my point.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Swamp on June 12, 2008, 03:57:40 PM
What I didn't like about this story was the way it was done.  The whole story seemed shrouded in the intent to provide some sort of ethical epiphany.  It wasn't even subtle...

I agree.  I was going to say subilty is best, but that sounds like you are trying to sneak something in.  I guess the best way is to present real honest conflicts and real honest consequenses for decisions made, good or bad.  I think the consequence is what is missing many times in media when a moral or value is brushed aside.  I think Bambi is a great example, as Corydon pointed out.  It shows the "reality" of the situation without setting aside an expositional "here's what we've learned".  (Of course we all know after watching that "Man is evil")
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: doctorclark on June 13, 2008, 11:30:57 PM
Alright: I was all set to complain here about this story (something along the lines of nostalgic-themes-and-YA-labels-are-no-excuse-for-static-characters-and-virtually-nonexistent-plot), but so many of these comments are so positive that I feel I may have missed something.  Going back for another listen...
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Chodon on June 18, 2008, 04:04:57 PM
I know I'm really late to the game (I have fallen behind on listening to EP, PP, and PC episodes), but here goes:

I still haven't recovered from the realization that I am never going into space.  I got that epiphany from "Schwartz Between the Galaxies".  Yeah, we (as humans) will get there someday, but we (as in you and I) will not.  We're born on this rock, we live on this rock, and we're going to die on this rock.  It just sucks, and makes me depressed.  This story reopened the wound for me.  Sure, it had an optimistic ending, but it shows how far we are from getting to space.  Like all these teenagers working in their basements are going to solve the issues of FTL travel...I feel like sci-fi is tougher to get involved in now, and it sucks. 

Damn you "Schwarts Between the Galaxies"!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: stePH on June 18, 2008, 04:46:10 PM
I still haven't recovered from the realization that I am never going into space.  I got that epiphany from "Schwartz Between the Galaxies".  Yeah, we (as humans) will get there someday, but we (as in you and I) will not.  We're born on this rock, we live on this rock, and we're going to die on this rock.  It just sucks, and makes me depressed.  This story reopened the wound for me.  Sure, it had an optimistic ending, but it shows how far we are from getting to space.  Like all these teenagers working in their basements are going to solve the issues of FTL travel...I feel like sci-fi is tougher to get involved in now, and it sucks. 

Who says we need FTL?  Generation ships, baby!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: eytanz on June 18, 2008, 05:16:08 PM
I still haven't recovered from the realization that I am never going into space.  I got that epiphany from "Schwartz Between the Galaxies".  Yeah, we (as humans) will get there someday, but we (as in you and I) will not.  We're born on this rock, we live on this rock, and we're going to die on this rock.  It just sucks, and makes me depressed.  This story reopened the wound for me.  Sure, it had an optimistic ending, but it shows how far we are from getting to space.  Like all these teenagers working in their basements are going to solve the issues of FTL travel...I feel like sci-fi is tougher to get involved in now, and it sucks. 

Who says we need FTL?  Generation ships, baby!

Note the bolded segment. Generation ships may eventually allow the human race to spread beyond its current little ball of rock, but they offer little solace to those that want to personally see a differnet planet.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 18, 2008, 06:55:28 PM
Generation ships may eventually allow the human race to spread beyond its current little ball of rock, but they offer little solace to those that want to personally see a differnet planet.
Very powerful telescopes?
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 18, 2008, 06:56:56 PM
Or, what about slowships with cryogenic freezing? It's not impossible that people alive today will spend several centuries frozen so they can wake up on another planet.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 18, 2008, 07:00:00 PM
Or, what about slowships with cryogenic freezing? It's not impossible that people alive today will spend several centuries frozen so they can wake up on another planet.

Or is "cryogenic freezing" a tautological redundancy? I think maybe it is.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: stePH on June 18, 2008, 07:01:08 PM
Or, what about slowships with cryogenic freezing? It's not impossible that people alive today will spend several centuries frozen so they can wake up on another planet.

Or is "cryogenic freezing" a tautological redundancy? I think maybe it is.

Kind of like "digital downloads"?
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Darwinist on June 18, 2008, 07:01:34 PM
Or, what about slowships with cryogenic freezing? It's not impossible that people alive today will spend several centuries frozen so they can wake up on another planet.

Or is "cryogenic freezing" a tautological redundancy? I think maybe it is.

As opposed to "cryogenic melting".
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Kaa on June 18, 2008, 07:02:53 PM
Or is "cryogenic freezing" a tautological redundancy? I think maybe it is.

Oh, you can freeze people without it being cryogenics. But I think the preferred term is "cryogenics" without the "freezing" part. :)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: eytanz on June 18, 2008, 07:23:38 PM
I think the proper term for freezing and reviving humans is "cryonics". "Cryogenics" is the broader term for research into the effects of freezing things, living or not.

It may be possible, but given that we are nowhere near the technology level needed to safely thaw a frozen person, we have no idea what pre-freezing preperation is necessary for a safe thaw. Freezing yourself now is a huge gamble, as it may turn out that thawing requires you to have taken a specific medication pre-freeze, or that the brain needs to be frozen in a particular speed (or maybe different brain regions need to be frozen in a specific order), or what not. If you're already terminally ill then you probably have nothing to lose, but allowing yourself to be frozen is about as sensible as letting yourself be blasted by radiation in order to develop superhuman strength.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Roney on June 18, 2008, 08:30:30 PM
I just felt that it was so swollen with morals that there was not enough space for good storyline.

I can see why you might say that, but I thought it was the profusion of moral lessons that saved the story.  If it had been in the style of a ST:TNG episode where everything was built around a single Valuable Lesson it would have driven me crazy (as it seems to have done for many Escapees).  Off the top of my head, the girl in the story learnt (or at least had the opportunity to learn)

These are such intrinsic parts of growing up that it felt more like a coming of age story than anything too preachy.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Chodon on June 19, 2008, 02:11:08 AM
If you're already terminally ill then you probably have nothing to lose, but allowing yourself to be frozen is about as sensible as letting yourself be blasted by radiation in order to develop superhuman strength.
:D I laughed my ass off when I read that...

Funny story.  We used to have a 20KV X-ray machine at a place I worked.  It was used for X-raying metallic welds and castings.  I asked our X-ray specialist what would happen if I was in there while it was on, and if I would gain powers like the Hulk (yes, I know it was gamma rays but I figured I'd ask anyway).  He described the horrible, horrible way I would die over weeks if I was in there, then he told me about a guy he went to school with who worked on gamma ray machines.  It's just a radioactive substance that emits gamma rays, and is used for testing metals like x-ray machines.  A shield is slid in front of the emitter to turn it "off".   I put off in quotes, because the gamma rays are always being emitted, they are just blocked by the shield.  The only thing is that if that shield gets jammed or for some reason can't block the emitter the machine is still "on" and someone needs to fix it.  That's what this guy did.  Talk about a freaky job...one false move and you die a very drawn out and painful death.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 19, 2008, 08:24:50 AM
Cryogenic freezing, generation shps!  NAH!!!

I'm putting my bet on, jump/warp/wormhole or some other technolgy not limited by the speed of light, one reason - imagination! as in Asimov, Star Srek, and Stargate, so you can call me a madman, no one is putting me in an Electrolux!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: wintermute on June 19, 2008, 11:42:40 AM
Star Shrek?

There's a crossover someone has to write...
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Kaa on June 19, 2008, 12:33:10 PM
Star Shrek?

There's a crossover someone has to write...

The Three Blind Mice would simply have to be Navigation.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: OsamaBinLondon on June 19, 2008, 01:14:26 PM
LOL   :D
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: RKG on June 19, 2008, 06:39:58 PM
Who says we need FTL?  Generation ships, baby!

Generation Ships?  FTL?   Escape Pod, baby!

Star Shrek?  There's a crossover someone has to write...

"A Vulcan is like an onion...."

Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Ocicat on June 19, 2008, 08:38:09 PM
Generation ships.  Now there's a terrible idea.

Okay, so I get being committed enough to human expansion into space that you're willing to board a spaceship and die there.  I'd sign up.  But imagine being *born* on a spaceship, and being told you'd die there because of a decision your parents made.  What a shitty deal!  Now there's something to rebel against!  Of course, when the kids are old enough that they're in charge it would probably be impossible to turn the ship around, but it seems to me almost inevitable that the mission is going to get compromised. 
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: DKT on June 19, 2008, 08:41:27 PM
I completely agree with occiat.  You thought there was angst when *you* were a teenager!
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: eytanz on June 19, 2008, 09:32:05 PM
Generation ships.  Now there's a terrible idea.

Okay, so I get being committed enough to human expansion into space that you're willing to board a spaceship and die there.  I'd sign up.  But imagine being *born* on a spaceship, and being told you'd die there because of a decision your parents made.  What a shitty deal!  Now there's something to rebel against!  Of course, when the kids are old enough that they're in charge it would probably be impossible to turn the ship around, but it seems to me almost inevitable that the mission is going to get compromised. 

For an excellent novel about what can go wrong with generation ships (among other things), I strongly recommend Alasdair Reynold's Chasm City.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Nobilis on June 19, 2008, 11:18:01 PM
I don't think generation ships will ever be built as generation ships.

Instead, I think we'll see space communities built in places like orbital stations and asteroids, which then have propulsion systems attached which launch them towards other stars.

<sarcasm>Could you imagine being born on one planet, growing up there, and never having the opportunity to leave, just because your parents were born there?  Wow, that would suck.</sarcasm>
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: ermghost on June 20, 2008, 02:28:35 AM
I didn't care for this one. There was something about it that just seemed too cut-and-paste for me. I mean, how many times can we hear about the poor, misunderstood nerd-girl? And, I've always been a pretty nerdy person, but I couldn't find myself relating to the main character at all. She just didn't seem realistic. It's like this was written by somebody who had never actually been unpopular in middle school, but had seen a lot of cute movies with unpopular girl chracters. The author was totally aping the character Violet from Pixar's the Incredibles.
Plus, it tried really hard to be super-touching and sweet, but that seemed to fall flat. Because I didn't connect with the primary character, the touching moments didn't resonate at all; in fact, they irritated me.
The narration was good. I have a feeling that without that narration, though, I probably would have just shut the story off after the first three minutes.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Windup on June 20, 2008, 02:41:56 AM

But imagine being *born* on a spaceship, and being told you'd die there because of a decision your parents made.  What a shitty deal!  Now there's something to rebel against! 
 

I dunno; most people, most of the time, lived in areas smaller than the prospective multi-generation ships because of their parent's decisions.  When I visited Nigeria 20 years ago, the old men (guys in their mid-40's) would tell you, "When I was young, if I met a man in the field who did not speak my language, I would kill him."  And many of those languages were spoken only in a handful of villages.  They just didn't get around much.

In The Arms of Krupp, William Manchester reports that as recently as WWI, it was the ambition of most workers for the Krupp factories in Germany to "...die within sight of the church where they were baptized."  And my own grandmother could only be induced to travel outside the bounds of the county where she was born by the prospect of visiting grandchildren. She'd probably regard having them confined to the immediate vicinity as a good thing.

That being said, getting any organization to hold together and pursue the same basic mission for several generations is a tough thing to do.  It's been possible to charter a corporation -- which is theoretically immortal -- for something like 500 years.  Now consider how many corporations celebrate even their 100th birthday.  Now consider how many of *those* are still pursuing the same basic mission.  Very few...

I think STL interstellar travel will either have to be managed through some form of hibernation/reawakening or after people achieve very, very long life spans.  If you knew you would probably live and be healthy for 1,000 years, investing 25, 50 or even 100 years of it in an interstellar voyage wouldn't seem like such a big deal.  I've made car trips across Nebraska that certainly seemed longer than that...
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Ersatz Coffee on June 25, 2008, 01:33:43 PM
I actually quite enjoyed this one, despite the constant feeling of 'this is going to be a moral lesson'. Only the very last paragraph spoilt it for me - that stuff about 'one day we'll go to the stars' - over-egging the pudding, to my mind; it would have been more powerful just to leave it on that epiphanic image of all the people gathered on the beach, alone and yet not really alone.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: ROUS on June 26, 2008, 05:53:45 PM
I left the story feeling like there were many unanswered questions; but not in the good thought-provoking way, more like I had a hole in my thoughts that needed to be filled.  I am not sure if I think the moral of the story is good or bad. It feels more to me that Jenny learned that the intentions of other people, regardless of how good, can really mess up your own life. Yes she found other "outcasts", but at what cost?  And I do not understand why the aliens made her wait until dawn; if they just wanted her, why?  I know it was a needed plot element, but a little more explanation would have helped me a lot.

Technically the narration was very well done, and I did not sense a "young adult" feel to it.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Void Munashii on June 27, 2008, 03:01:30 PM
I actually quite enjoyed this one, despite the constant feeling of 'this is going to be a moral lesson'. Only the very last paragraph spoilt it for me - that stuff about 'one day we'll go to the stars' - over-egging the pudding, to my mind; it would have been more powerful just to leave it on that epiphanic image of all the people gathered on the beach, alone and yet not really alone.

  I think your ending would have been the happier one. I found the fact that the group was still wanting to leave Earth because they still feel so alienated from it was incredibly sad. If the problem was that they felt alone, and felt that no one would really miss them anyway, then surely discovering that they are not alone, that they are many, should give them some comfort, but instead it just seems to have made them all redouble their efforts.

  Maybe I just misunderstood what the speaker's problem was, or maybe I'm assuming that everyone else was sharing the same problem incorrectly. It's entirely possible that I am completely missing the author's point, but I felt sad for them at the end. It would have definitely been a more positive story to me without that last bit.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Unblinking on August 27, 2010, 05:14:06 PM
I didn't care for this one, I'm afraid.

1.  It seemed very after-school special-y, but with an unintentionally antisocial message.  The main message I read from it is "You should always keep your promises, even to people that you hate.  But when you do, don't be surprised if they f--- you over in the end."  Um, okay, I guess.  If that'd happened to me, I'd be inclined to never keep a promise again.

2.  The aliens' behavior seems like nothing more than a plot element.  Why do they make her wait til dawn?  Why do they come ALL THE WAY HERE intending to pick someone up and then when it gets too crowded, don't take anyone. 

Are they trying to accelerate human expansion into space?  That was the impression I got while listening, but this is a pretty damned roundabout random way to do it that's liable to  leave the only humans they meet more pissed than motivated, and anyone with sufficient knowledge and funding to support a space launch will ridicule these people rather than aid them.

Are they trying to teach her a moral lesson along the lines of the #1 above?  Not sure why they'd want to do that.

Are they inscrutable aliens being inscrutable because it's their nature?  I guess, maybe, but it didn't seem fitting in this case.  I've believed it before in other stories, such as the Arilou in Star Control 2, but it didn't seem to fit here.

3.  So a bunch of random people are going to launch a space program without funding or any particular expertise?  No one mentions the great likelihood that they'll try for their whole lives and die on the planet just like everyone else, not to mention all the casualties from experiments with jet fuel, cryogenics, etc, that are likely to occur.  In this way it reminds me of the Podcastle story where a small town scraped together money to launch a ship to Mars, despite completely misunderstanding the science behind it all (i.e. we need to develop plants that will grow in red light).  In both this case and that one I felt like I was supposed to get a lasting message of hope from it.  But refusing to actually consider the outcome of your actions is not hope, it's denial.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Wilson Fowlie on August 27, 2010, 06:33:16 PM
Unblinking: It looks like you're working your way backwards through unread unlistened-to episodes.  Cool.  I feel I should give you a heads-up, though, that episode 109 is a sequel of episode 70.  Just FYI. :)
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Unblinking on August 27, 2010, 06:51:30 PM
Unblinking: It looks like you're working your way backwards through unread unlistened-to episodes.  Cool.  I feel I should give you a heads-up, though, that episode 109 is a sequel of episode 70.  Just FYI. :)

I appreciate the head's up, but actually I've listened to everything (usually in order), but the flash fiction contest distracted me from my goal of commenting in all the story threads.  :)

The order at which I'm commenting on them may seem like reverse publication order, but that's not quite right.  I'm working my way backward through the comment threads in the order that they're listed on the forum here, meaning that as I go on I'm commenting on stories that got their most recent comment the longest ago--In this case, 26 months ago.  :P
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Wilson Fowlie on August 27, 2010, 08:12:43 PM
Wow, that's quite a goal.  Good luck.
Title: Re: EP161: Alien Promises
Post by: Unblinking on August 27, 2010, 10:50:20 PM
Wow, that's quite a goal.  Good luck.

You can count me for goals which are astronomical in effort and short on benefit.   ;D

Truth is, I just like discussing the stories, so it keeps me entertained in the time between other things happening.