Escape Artists

PodCastle => Episode Comments => Topic started by: Talia on September 13, 2011, 02:36:09 PM

Title: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Talia on September 13, 2011, 02:36:09 PM
PodCastle 174: The Parable of the Shower (http://podcastle.org/2011/09/13/podcastle-174-the-parable-of-the-shower)

by Leah Bobet (http://www.leahbobet.com)

Read by Laurice White (http://www.itsthavoice.com/)

Originally appeared in Lone Star Stories (http://literary.erictmarin.com)

The angel of the LORD cometh upon you in the shower at the worst possible moment: one hand placed upon thy right buttock and the other bearing soap, radio blaring, humming a heathen song of sin.

Fear not! he proclaimeth from the vicinity of the shampoo caddy, and the soap falleth from thy hand.

Motherfu—thou sayest, and then thou seest the light, the wings, the blazing eyes like sunlight and starlight both at once, and since thy mother raised thee right thou coverest thy mouth with one hand and makest the sign of the cross with the other. It is the soap-hand which covereth thy mouth: thou gett’st soap in thy mouth, and spittest—away from the angel of the LORD—and do not curse again though it is terrible hard.

The angel of the LORD he does laugh.


Rated R for language, sex.

ETA: Added a link to Laurice White's website.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ToooooMuchCoffeeMan on September 13, 2011, 06:33:59 PM
This comment isn't actually about the story. What I want to know is if a transcript of Dave Thompson's introductory rant is available. Thanks for calling out OSC.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on September 13, 2011, 09:54:24 PM
I really loved this one, in part because I've had my own negative experiences with angels. I mean, they mean well - to whatever extent they are capable of free will - but they can't help it. They tend to be authoritarian. They want the job done right and they want it done right now, and they aren't good about human things like "feelings" and "freedom." It doesn't help that one perspective has dominated their point of view for a long time. The angel in this story probably didn't want to come off like a rapist/cop, and it shows in the end. If you're persistent, they come around in the end.

I have to admit, though, that I couldn't help but read this story as "the parable of the shower," as in one who shows, as in opposed to a grower - as in somebody possessed of the dubious blessing of a penis that is impressively large when flaccid (rather than simply becoming so when aroused - a more common condition).

I don't think the version in my head would have been better, but it certainly would have been different.

Anyway, I enjoyed this story immensely. I thought the characters were excellently expressed in very few words, and the switch between modern and badly translated bible-talk (I was a religion major in college - don't get me started) was hilarious and added a lot to the piece.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: kodermike on September 14, 2011, 12:27:51 AM
*wow* Just *wow*. I've been listening to podcastle and pseudopod for a year or so now, but I've never been so moved to leave a comment as I have for this story. The voice acting was superb, as we've come to expect from Laurice White, but Leah Bobet's story made me laugh hard - which might not be such a great thing in traffic on I-95, but let the other drivers writhe in jealousy. I'm sure there will be flak for this one, there always is when religion is involved, but I think Dave's intro set the mood and the story sealed the deal. Keep it coming!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: DKT on September 14, 2011, 04:56:06 AM
This comment isn't actually about the story. What I want to know is if a transcript of Dave Thompson's introductory rant is available. Thanks for calling out OSC.

Oh, hey - glad you liked it. Here's what I said:

Hello, and welcome back to PodCastle. I’m your host and co-editor Dave Thompson. Today - let’s talk about blasphemy. Specifically, of the Judeo-Christian variety. I’ve mentioned in the past that I’m a Quaker, and perhaps because of that, or perhaps because I’m a weirdo, I have a different perspective as to what I find blasphemous. Here’s where it comes from: what I genuinely dig about Jesus Christ is when push comes to shove, he said there are only two things that matter: Love God, and love your neighbor as yourself. That’s it. Everything else? Falls beneath those – the two greatest commandments. I guess John Lennon really was right according to JC. All you need is love. Now, we could spend hours talking about what loving God actually means, but love your neighbor as yourself? That’s a lot easier to interpret.

And so, when I log on to the old internets, and read that Orson Scott Card, a mormon, has a novella coming out soon that, as a plot point, suggests that since Hamlet’s daddy was gay and thus the ghost that sets all things in motion was actually a malevolent spirit – because again - he was gay and thus, said gayness caused the evil spirit to be the real bad guy in Shakespeare’s play, well, I not only call bullshit, but I call blasphemy too. To me, that sounds like ignoring one of the greatest commandment - loving your neighbor, and instead spewing hate. I know, I know. It happens a lot. But if we want to talk about blasphemy, I don’t have to look any further. Love your neighbor. There are no conditions placed on that. Love your neighbor as yourself. It's written in red folks. Don’t just talk about it, don’t try to convince anyone you know better than they do how they were really born, who they should love and who they should fuck, that you love the sinner, but hate the sin. Blah blah blah. That kind of shit isn't Christian. Just love.

So, with that definition in mind, I don’t particularly see this week’s story as blasphemous in the least.  This week at PodCastle we’re proud to present “The Parable of the Shower,” by Leah Bobet, and originally published at Lone Star Stories. We’ll link to the text in our show notes.


For those that are interested, here's the review I read of OSC's book (http://www.raintaxi.com/online/2011summer/card.shtml), pointed out to me by friends on my LJ.

*wow* Just *wow*. I've been listening to podcastle and pseudopod for a year or so now, but I've never been so moved to leave a comment as I have for this story. The voice acting was superb, as we've come to expect from Laurice White, but Leah Bobet's story made me laugh hard - which might not be such a great thing in traffic on I-95, but let the other drivers writhe in jealousy. I'm sure there will be flak for this one, there always is when religion is involved, but I think Dave's intro set the mood and the story sealed the deal. Keep it coming!

Thanks so much for signing up! Glad you liked this one, and I hope we see you around more often :)

Also, just a general note - I'm going to beat Fenrix to this and point out that if you like Laurice White's readings, you should check out the latest Pseudopod - The Eater (http://pseudopod.org/2011/09/09/pseduopod-246-the-eater/). I'm really excited to check it out myself :)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: lorax on September 14, 2011, 05:27:12 AM
Mr. Thompson,

     Hello, I had to write and comment because I love this podcast, and greatly enjoy your contribution to it. I wanted to let you know that I am a Mormon, and as one I Know that the greatest law Jesus gave us is to love God and next to love each other. We as Mormon are taught to love everyone, but none of us are perfect. We are all still learning to love our neighbors more!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: iamafish on September 14, 2011, 10:46:51 AM
you and everybody else, pall. :P

I took a bit of time to get into this story - the writing style didn't do much for me - but once, i did, i really enjoyed it. I like that we can write and listen to light hearted - but still with a serious point - stories about religious. Nothing is and nothing should be sacred when it comes to fiction. I like stories that challenge conventional religion, conventional ideas and conventional assumptions, as well as making you laugh. Good story and fantastic reading.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Scattercat on September 14, 2011, 12:48:29 PM
Win.  Utter win.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: dragonsbreath on September 14, 2011, 06:39:41 PM
As a convert to Catholicism I had to put aside my initial reaction of disgust at the play on the Annunciation. Once past that, I enjoyed the story. The voice characterizations, the surprisingly supporting role of the neighbor and the fact that the "angel" seemed to display some disappointment at having to copulate with an elderly lady versus a young, pretty girl. It was quite a clever way of showing that angels are not always so pure, in the confines of this story.

My only qualm with the ending was the suggestion that a "new God" be molded according to human will.

BTW - The intro was really helpful in setting the stage for recognizing the dangers of judgementalism. And thanks for using my favorite quote from St. Francis to end the program.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on September 14, 2011, 06:50:10 PM
My only qualm with the ending was the suggestion that a "new God" be molded according to human will.

Why is that a qualm? I'm a heathen Jew here, but would it be incorrect to say that Jesus was shaped by the experiences of his mortal life? I think that's what they are going for here, that the child will be a new God in the sense that he will be a new incarnation of God born as a human, in the same way that Jesus was an incarnation of God born in mortal flesh in Christian mythology. The character is referring to a chance to shape and mold this new incarnation of God, just as Jesus was certainly influenced by his parents, friends, and so on.

As I wrote above, I was a religion major in college, which is why I find your reaction so fascinating. I totally get needing to get over the not-so-gently mocking tone of the angel's arrival, but not needing to get over the idea that if God is going to be born as a human he's going to be molded by the humans in his life.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: FlowerFancier on September 14, 2011, 08:15:52 PM
Wow, agree with Kodermike! I'm a recent convert to Podcastle. Listened to this story while I worked this morning and was transported into another body, in another world, the writing and the reading were so vivid. I wonder whether is sometimes a great reader I mean voice actor..like this who makes the difference between a story being perceived as blasphemy or inspiration? Not to shortchange the writing by any means, which I loved too and which made me laugh out loud. Enjoyed the concept of taking responsibility for shaping our own Deity and the form in which He/She can act on the world. Oh, and loved your intro too, so just a whole lot of love for this episode... Amen :)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: danooli on September 14, 2011, 09:29:09 PM
Glad I'm not alone in my opinions on this weeks story  Absolute brilliance both in the story and in the reading. 

Like others, I literally laughed out loud a number of times.  "THOU CANS'T USE DAYCARE?!?!"  ;D
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Wilson Fowlie on September 14, 2011, 11:05:27 PM
This had me laughing out loud, too.

My favourite line: Yes, thou repliest, and diggest in the drawer.

Like others, I literally laughed out loud a number of times.  "THOU CANS'T USE DAYCARE?!?!"  ;D

This one actually bothered me a bit, and I'll explain why.

First of all, though, I need to say that I really enjoyed Laurice White's performance. Her deadpan delivery of the KJV-like language (Early Modern English, if anyone cares) contrasted with the street-wise (and utterly differentiated!) deliveries of the main character and Missus Van Metre* were lovely to hear. This goes into my set of readings that I will listen to again as much for the narrator as for the story.

That being said, she did have a few missteps in pronunciation and delivery, and danooli's example was one of them.

The original text is:
I’m only twenty-three, I can’t raise a kid right now—
THOU CANST USE DAYCARE, the angel boometh.

In other words, it is telling her (or at least suggesting to her) to use daycare, not asking her why she can't. This is because 'canst' is Early Modern English for can, not — as many people think — can't. So Ms. White's intonation of it as a question was contrary to the meaning.

There were one or two others — such as pronouncing 'inexorable' as 'inexonorable' — that distracted me a little. But they were small, nitpicky things that didn't detract very much from the masterful performance.

(Also, I note, on checking the text, that another of the bits that niggled at me was from the author, which is a bit of a relief. In the passage Thou stand bemused for a moment it seems to me that it should be 'standest' or, perhaps, 'standst'.)



*Haha, it's actually spelt that way — 'Missus' and all — in the text (http://literary.erictmarin.com/shower.htm)! Brilliant.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: InfiniteMonkey on September 15, 2011, 01:49:22 AM
I don't usually cotton to modern world/ancient faith mash-ups like this, but this was done so well, with both humor and dignity, that I loved it.

My only problem was before the story started. See, I kept hearing the name "Lorena Bobbit", and was expecting something very different.

(though I'm not *exactly* sure how this is a parable).

And as for Dave's opening rant - GO MAN GO!!! (I know several people in the skiffy community who are agitated by this).
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Kconv on September 15, 2011, 03:52:02 AM
This VERY much reminded me of Good Omens.

I could almost picture Crombey bursting in on this scene any moment, with Queen playing on his ipod.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: danooli on September 15, 2011, 10:54:13 AM
This is because 'canst' is Early Modern English for can, not — as many people think — can't.

Another new piece of knowledge I've gained from the Escape Artist forums!  Thanks Mr. Fowlie!

Although, literal meaning of "canst" aside, I still love the thought of "An Angel Of The Lord" suggesting daycare!


Also, please let me echo those who say Dave really nailed the intro.  DKT, you're alright in my book!   ;D
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: NomadicScribe on September 15, 2011, 12:00:07 PM
I'm going to go against the grain on Dave's opening here. Not because I disagree with his point about Orson Scott Card; believe me, I am on board with the belief that "Hamlet's Father" is all kinds of wrong. Heavy-handed social politics are one of the reasons why I don't read very much Card, and adding insult to injury is hijacking a Shakespeare play in order to fill it with a blatant anti-gay message.

But I also have to take exception to Dave taking it upon himself to call Orson Scott Card "blasphemous." This may or may not be true; I am not a religious person, and many such theological details escape me. However, I believe that preaching should be left off of the podcast. It's one thing to take a moral stance, but another thing entirely to judge someone based on a disagreement about the way some old holy book is interpreted.

As for the story, it was short sweet and entertaining. I enjoyed the narration, and the twist of using scripture to argue with an angel. Well done.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on September 15, 2011, 01:31:52 PM
I'm going to go against the grain on Dave's opening here. Not because I disagree with his point about Orson Scott Card; believe me, I am on board with the belief that "Hamlet's Father" is all kinds of wrong. Heavy-handed social politics are one of the reasons why I don't read very much Card, and adding insult to injury is hijacking a Shakespeare play in order to fill it with a blatant anti-gay message.

But I also have to take exception to Dave taking it upon himself to call Orson Scott Card "blasphemous." This may or may not be true; I am not a religious person, and many such theological details escape me. However, I believe that preaching should be left off of the podcast. It's one thing to take a moral stance, but another thing entirely to judge someone based on a disagreement about the way some old holy book is interpreted.

I don't think it's for anyone to take exception or not. Like right and wrong, good and bad, and all other judgements, blasphemy is in the eye of the beholder. You don't want to hear Dave's beholding, don't listen to his podcast. I see no reason that this - or any - topic should be off limits to our various hosts' meanderings.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: InfiniteMonkey on September 15, 2011, 03:05:25 PM
P.S. I didn't even mind that it was in Second Person....  ;)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: NomadicScribe on September 15, 2011, 03:35:38 PM
I don't think it's for anyone to take exception or not. Like right and wrong, good and bad, and all other judgements, blasphemy is in the eye of the beholder. You don't want to hear Dave's beholding, don't listen to his podcast. I see no reason that this - or any - topic should be off limits to our various hosts' meanderings.

With all due respect though, I think Dave cancels out his own message by saying, "It's not OK for OSC to judge people's sexuality. But it's OK for me to condemn his eternal fate (or whatever) because of the way he reads his holybooks differently from the way I do."

I'll keep listening to this podcast, obviously, but I'm just hoping that sermons aren't going to become a regular thing. If I wanted preaching I'd go to church (or mosque or temple or Fox news....)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Spindaddy on September 15, 2011, 03:40:20 PM
You had me at "Motherfu—thou sayest, "

Awesome story and I appreciate Dave's calling out of OSC in the beginning. What really attracts me to PodCastle in particular is the personal nature of the introductions to the stories. If I get bored, well, thats why I have a fast forward button.

The story itself was great. I loved the reading and the humor in the story was absolutely awesome. I've been going through a rough spell lately and this story gave me a much needed laugh. With that all said, is september's theme "Stories from the Restroom/ Bathroom month?" If so, I think thats awesome!

Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: dragonsbreath on September 15, 2011, 04:03:37 PM
In response to Electricpaladin – I thank you for your thoughtful response and appreciate the opportunity to clear-up “my qualm.” My initial take on the ending was that it was trying to justify moral relativism. Your take seems quite understandable. The child’s human nature would certainly be influenced by its family, but its divine nature as a reflection of God would remain pure to its form. This is an interesting metaphor to religion itself.

Now, I know this next comment on moral relativism will seem like trying to thread a needle with a sledgehammer, but I will give it a try. One the main aspects of the Church that I (as a recent convert) have come to love and appreciate are its steadfastness to its ideals over 2000 years. I do acknowledge that the human part of the church has failed to live up to them, but her spiritual component has remained pure to its foundation. That being said, I accept the moral precepts of the Church and try my best to live up to them, but I try not to push this on others. To give an example of my acceptance of the moral authority of the church and the rejection of moral relativism, but taking into account the influence of modern times on its practices, I offer this. A heterosexual man, who wishes to be a priest, takes an oath of celibacy as part of becoming a priest. No problem. But suppose an openly gay man wishes to be a priest and takes an oath of celibacy in order to be a priest. Should this be a problem? It should not be, in terms of the spiritual aspects of the Church. But for the human part of the Church, it would be a problem. This is the Church practicing moral relativism by denying a man from fulfilling his calling, by being judgmental against his sexual orientation, dismissing his earnest promise to remain celebrant like his straight brethren. This is moral relativism at its worst.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on September 15, 2011, 04:14:18 PM
With all due respect though, I think Dave cancels out his own message by saying, "It's not OK for OSC to judge people's sexuality. But it's OK for me to condemn his eternal fate (or whatever) because of the way he reads his holybooks differently from the way I do."

I love the phrase "with all due respect." It doesn't really mean anything, does it? :P

Anyway, I think you're reading a lot into Dave's statements that he didn't actually say. Dave never commented on Card's eternal fate. He expresses his opinion about Card's reading of a shared text. That's exactly what we do here on this forums, isn't it? Talk about a shared text.

Now, this is a text that both Dave and Card care a lot about. And, it's a highly controversial text, because unlike a short story, its interpretations have caused both great joy and advancement as well as great sorrow and pain. In my mind, that doesn't mean that we shouldn't discuss our interpretations - in fact, it means that we should discuss them more often.

Keep in mind that I was a religion major in college, so I love this shit.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: DKT on September 15, 2011, 04:14:56 PM
I'm going to go against the grain on Dave's opening here. Not because I disagree with his point about Orson Scott Card; believe me, I am on board with the belief that "Hamlet's Father" is all kinds of wrong. Heavy-handed social politics are one of the reasons why I don't read very much Card, and adding insult to injury is hijacking a Shakespeare play in order to fill it with a blatant anti-gay message.

But I also have to take exception to Dave taking it upon himself to call Orson Scott Card "blasphemous." This may or may not be true; I am not a religious person, and many such theological details escape me. However, I believe that preaching should be left off of the podcast. It's one thing to take a moral stance, but another thing entirely to judge someone based on a disagreement about the way some old holy book is interpreted.

As for the story, it was short sweet and entertaining. I enjoyed the narration, and the twist of using scripture to argue with an angel. Well done.

What?!?! You dare defile and/or judge my sacred intro! BLASEPHEMY!!!

 ;D

Nah, that's cool.

With all due respect though, I think Dave cancels out his own message by saying, "It's not OK for OSC to judge people's sexuality. But it's OK for me to condemn his eternal fate (or whatever) because of the way he reads his holybooks differently from the way I do."

Um, just for the record, I didn't suggest condemnation of anyone's eternal fate, because that's not my thing or my place. Just, I find it...more than problematic that when someone who professes to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ contradicts what is supposedly one of his greatest commandments.

I've obviously got no idea what happens after we die, nor who goes where (if anywhere). But if there is a heaven, and both me and OSC are lucky enough to end up in it, I hope that I can spend a small fraction of eterntity by buying OSC a beer or a Sprite (preferably, in a gay bar).
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: DKT on September 15, 2011, 04:18:40 PM
P.S. I didn't even mind that it was in Second Person....  ;)

I was actually waiting for this, the real controversy of this story, to appear here on the forum!

NOT SECOND PERSON!!! OH GOD IT BURNS!!! IT BURNS!!!

 :D

Glad you maybe kind of enjoyed it! I, uh, guess I'll keep waiting ;)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: NomadicScribe on September 15, 2011, 04:40:41 PM
I love the phrase "with all due respect." It doesn't really mean anything, does it? :P

You're right, it really doesn't. It's a formality I picked up during my military service.

Anyway, I think you're reading a lot into Dave's statements that he didn't actually say.

I'll admit, this was probably a bit of a straw man on my part. Bad form. Maybe it's just 20 years of conditioning (long story) speaking, but when I hear BLASPHEMY it's hard not to immediately think of stuff like the great flood, destruction of Sodom & Gomorrah, smashing the tower of Babel, and all the other delightful things that the old testament god liked to do.

Either way, I understand it wasn't meant quite that way, so I'm glad to at least hear that Dave wasn't trying to turn his podcast into some kind of religious hate plateform. I would regret seeing one of my favorite podcasts turn into that, and I'm glad it isn't so.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Captain (none given) on September 15, 2011, 05:31:24 PM
Well done! I loved this story and had to restrain myself from laughing so my coworkers wouldn't look at me funny all day. The reading was fantastic and it was well written.

I only have two tiny irks: the second person seemed only there for the constant use of "thou" and "thee," which I guess was the point, but it still kinda annoyed me; the second is how the angels didn't seem to understand how God operates. It really helped build the story and explore ideas of authoritarianism, but it still kinda bugged. Neither of these were actually problems with the story, just things that just kinda stuck with me.


So on to the real discussion... I was born and raised Roman Catholic. Baptized, confirmed, and I'm even a member of a Christ-centered fraternity (yes, they exist). The last religious story that had the word "blasphemy" thrown at it was "Hell is the Absence of God" by Ted Chiang. I went off on a tear about how it was a horrible, blasphemous story etc. I've calmed down since then, so I'm not starting another rant. I actually want to apologize for being so sensitive back then. Living with guys of different religious backgrounds plus a Jesuit education loosened me up about other people's religious ideas. I have to agree with Dave that there is really only one thing Christians need to focus on above all else: love. Love people, love God. Blasphemy is trying to void the core values of any religion which is usually a variant of "Love God with all your heart, mind, and soul and love your neighbor as yourself." So the only blasphemy is calling for hate.

On that note, Dave... Thank you for calling out OSC like you did. I only ask that we are careful about that, because as soon as we say "OSC is a blasphemer and he sucks!" then that's blasphemy as well because that hates just loops around in a big circle. I know that's not happening now, but I'm just saying we need to be careful. Hypocrisy can find one anywhere.

Written with love,
The Captain
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: aesculapius on September 15, 2011, 07:38:17 PM
Great story, and I think this is definitely one that gained a lot from the excellent reading. One of the best I've heard at Podcastle so far.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: slag on September 16, 2011, 08:54:49 PM
I am a Roman Catholic living with an Atheist, and have been for the past three years. Least to say there's been quite
a few discussions here and there about all manner o' existence over a friendly drink.
I really liked this story, mostly because I think it reminds a listener or a reader of their want for freedom of choice
when something they consider greater than themself comes asking for people to just give themself over to a
particular cause.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Fenrix on September 18, 2011, 04:51:51 AM
Also, just a general note - I'm going to beat Fenrix to this and point out that if you like Laurice White's readings, you should check out the latest Pseudopod - The Eater (http://pseudopod.org/2011/09/09/pseduopod-246-the-eater/). I'm really excited to check it out myself :)

Curses! Foiled again!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: raetsel on September 18, 2011, 09:13:02 AM
This was a great story that had me chuckling all the way to work. I can't praise the narration by Laurice White highly enough. It took a good story and made it a great one.

As for all the talk about blasphemy, well I have to say I don't believe in blasphemy because I don't believe people's religious beliefs should get special treatment just because they are "religious beliefs" per se and so they shouldn't have special words for offending them.

People can defend their beliefs and take offence or not regardless of whether they are their beliefs about their soccer team, how to raise kids or who sleeps with whom. The fact they are religious beliefs shouldn't give them special pleading, they stand or fall by the strength of their arguments and the evidence they present, regardless.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Rain on September 18, 2011, 09:25:41 AM
I had to stop the story after a few minutes as i found it completely impossible to listen to. I know the reader has a lot of fans, but i dont care for the strong southern accent and together with some writing that was trying to be clever instead of telling a coherent story i just didnt want to spend the time trying to find out if it got better.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: mbrennan on September 18, 2011, 10:10:46 AM
I'm with Spindaddy: at "Motherfu—thou sayest" I cracked up, and knew I was going to love this story.

In fact, I love it enough that I can even forgive it a) the use of second person (I'm another one who rarely likes that approach) and b) the errors in Early Modern English usage.  I once wrote a story in that style myself, and so I know first-hand how difficult it is to maintain for any real length of time; there were places in here where it slipped randomly into "you" instead of "thou," or used the third-person singular ending for second or for plural, etc.  Which is irrelevant to most listeners, I know -- but I noticed.  In a weaker story, they would have kicked me out of the narrative.  Here, it's only a minor quibble.

And yeah, the primary reason for the second-person pov is probably to highlight the tonal distinction between the modern dialogue and the archaic narration.  But I'm okay with that: at least there is a reason, which is more than I generally get from most second-person stories.

The thing I really find myself reflecting on is how many of the things described in the Bible were just as mundane to the Jews and Christians of antiquity as loofahs and showers are to us.  But it's odd to see our familiar mundanity presented in such a light . . . .
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Max e^{i pi} on September 18, 2011, 10:41:28 AM
Loved this story, might even be my new favorite.
The biblical thees, thines, thous and wouldsts added that extra little spice that takes a great story and elevates it to epic proportions, particularly when mixed with that inner-city-girl lingo. The contrast was breathtaking. Also, from now on I intend to use the verb "to googlest".
And Dave was right, Laurice White's reading was fantastic. Just hearing that "There's an angel in my shower and he wants to knock me up" in my mind makes me smile.
I particularly loved the surly-telephone-support-staff scene. It made me think of all the wasted hours I've spent on the phone trying to work my way up the fierce gauntlet of incompetents (not a typo, "people who are incompetent" and not "the pervasiveness of incompetence") to someone who can actually solve my problem. Doing it on a cosmic scale? Now that's brilliant.
I also liked the little biblical hints thrown in here and there, that added to the weirdness and just made it that much better.
Lastly, I'd like to point out a further significance in the boy's name, Joseph. See, this boy's job is to prepare the world for the new coming of the lord, and according to some messianic texts that is the role portrayed by the Messiah Son of Joseph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messiah_son_of_Joseph).
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Scattercat on September 18, 2011, 11:52:42 AM
Speaking as someone who works in a slightly atypical call center, the mythology around "the manager" is rather irritating.  People firmly believe that I, as the person on the phone, have Secret Powers that I'm not allowed to tell them I have, and the only way to get me to send out the Ninja SWAT Team is to talk to the "manager," who will make it happen if the callers are annoying enough.  Except in our line, the managers actually have even less ability to help than I do (and I don't so much "help" as "write down your crazy ranting in the form of a coherent narrative and forward it to your company, which ignores it.")  Thus, I get to have fun conversations that start with "I want to talk to the manager!" and end up with me listening to the manager on duty repeating the same stuff I just said and then coming and telling me the person hung up.

That crap might work in a customer service call center, bucko, but not on us.  Thus, I resent this story for cogently and convincingly portraying that myth as successful in action.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Max e^{i pi} on September 18, 2011, 12:26:21 PM
At the risk of derailing this thread...
Well, I had my ISP and infrastructure providers in mind when I wrote my post.
I'm fully aware that they deal with people not necessarily adept at this kind of thing all day every day. But when the people who are adept at this call, we would like to skip through the stages that we've already gone through: rebooting the computer, reseting the router, checking that all the cables are properly connected, requesting a new IP from the DNS and often even going through the logs and finding the problem which we can't solve by ourselves which is why we called for support.
Slogging through all that for hours on end with different low-level personnel only to be told what we knew from the beginning, that we need to talk to somebody higher up to fix this issue, goes beyond frustrating. It enters the mystic realm where ordinary peaceful human beings turn into raving lunatics who go on a rampage and write snarky blog posts long into the night discussing the futility of technology, humanity and whether we weren't better off staying in the trees.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Emerald on September 19, 2011, 06:01:33 AM
I have unsubscribed from Podcastle not because of this story. Maybe I will go back and finish it after reading some of the comments. But Dave Thompson has has gone potty mouth too many times. It is a testament to the quality of the podcast that I have held out so far beyond my limit. I'm not a prude (I watched Deadwood, my Rap isn't the radio version) but I don't publicly in front of anybody and everybody use words off the list of the worst ones we can say in this society and I don't have people in my life who put it out there for no good reason (just because I want to hear a story for example). Not to mention that profane is the antonym of religious and Quaker is a form of the Christian religion. Profane is also the near antonym of spiritual.  Whenever people say they are religious or talk about God using such language, I question it. Sorry my first post to the forums is negative. I guess that I have shown my general approval by donating money might make up for that. Thank you.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Scattercat on September 19, 2011, 07:40:57 AM
Right.  Treating other people as humans is secondary to whether or not you use profanity.  Clearly, anyone who fights for GLBT rights but says b-llsh-t in the process must be evil and not worth hearing.

Profanity is not inherently opposed to religious feeling any more than hysteria is actually caused by having a uterus.  Etymology is not destiny.  Your argument is bunk; there's nothing wrong with being offended by bad language if that's how you feel, but try to at least own it instead of using this weird twisted logic to claim that Dave is somehow violating the laws of the universe by speaking harshly.  Say that you're offended by bad language and leave it at that.

Although at that point, this particular story might cause you a few additional problems...
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Anyanwu on September 19, 2011, 08:30:12 AM
I absolutely loved this episode!  This has got to be one of your best.  The reading was awesome!  I know these women and their concerns. "Dealing with the angel of the lord is kinda like dealing with the police who stops you for driving while black"......priceless.  I felt like pod castle finally came to my neighborhood ('bought time, too). Thank you.  Keep up the good work!  
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: mbrennan on September 19, 2011, 09:09:30 AM
words off the list of the worst ones we can say in this society

I've come around to the firm opinion that the words we traditionally consider "profanity"?  Don't bother me much.  I honestly feel that nowadays, the worst words we can say in this society are the racial slurs and similar epithets, that seek to put down a group (black people, gays, women, the disabled, etc) just on the basis of who they are.  They're certainly the ones I cringe at the most, anyway, and avoid saying except for the purpose of discussing them.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: danooli on September 19, 2011, 10:57:30 AM
Aw, Emerald, what a shame.  If you get so offended by a simple word, maybe you're right in backing away from a place that celebrates words and how they are used.

I hope your, to my eye narrow, view of the world can expand someday.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Devoted135 on September 19, 2011, 04:25:16 PM
.....getting back to the story....

I usually don't like stories that use thee's and thou's because it's simply too difficult to pull off if you haven't studied Middle English. But this story did it was so much sass that I couldn't help but smile throughout. Laurice White was the perfect reader, and she brought the story to life in a way I doubt many other readers could have done.


Fun fact: did you know that "thee" was the informal version of "you" back in the day, used to express familiarity or sometimes disrespect? "You" was the formal/plural version so if it weren't for "thee" falling out of use we wouldn't have all the plural colloquialisms such as y'all. (Yes, I wiki-checked my facts, but I did actually know that before I checked :D).
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: InfiniteMonkey on September 19, 2011, 04:43:54 PM
Fun fact: did you know that "thee" was the informal version of "you" back in the day, used to express familiarity or sometimes disrespect?

Why, yes. Yes I did.

 ;)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: brlteach on September 19, 2011, 07:29:10 PM
DKT, Thanks for the clarification.  I'll de-ruffle my feathers, now :)

BTW, I didn't find the story blasphemas.  Look forward to next episode.




I mentioned Card's faith not to slam Mormons and LDS in general, or you in particular. I brought it up because his faith and my own share a common text (as you pointed out). When someone claims to follow Jesus's teachings, loving one another seems to be toward the top of the list - no matter how different they are. Hating a group of people because they're different seems to run contrary.

I don't hate Card by any stretch of the imagination. I am disappointed in him, and this novella in particular.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Talia on September 19, 2011, 08:13:39 PM
Hi everyone.

I've moved all the comments on the intro/the Mormon stuff to this thread. (http://forum.escapeartists.net/index.php?topic=5424.0). Any further comments on on that subject can go there (and remember please, please be nice).

Thanks!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: olivaw on September 20, 2011, 01:43:50 AM
The use of the second person makes me think more of the Qu'ran, which contains a great deal in the imperative mode, rather than the Bible (which is presumably what the Jacobean grammar is meant to suggest)
While the protagonist is a Christian, and the Second Coming is a Christian doctrine, most of the story is broad enough that it could be aimed at Islam, or Judaism, or any number of similar religions.
Equal opportunities blasphemy.  :D
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Calculating... on September 20, 2011, 09:25:34 PM
So I'm taking time out of my Medieval Christian Thought class to comment on this story ( which I just giggle at the ridiculousness of it) and I have to say I loved this story. It was great watching the angels who were stuck in the "old world" ideas of religion i.e. angel of the lord says jump, subject says how high, regardless of previous religious beliefs, watching them come face to face with modern day thought. Also, LOVE Laurice White, I loved her after Saints and I think I love her even more now. I definitely think she brought something to this story that other readers just could not. I had so much fun with this story, it was just the laugh I needed. Loved it.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Listener on September 21, 2011, 03:19:26 PM
This was a very funny, enjoyable story. The humor of writing it as a Biblical-style* parable definitely set it apart.

I idly wonder if the story was first written straight, and then thees and thous were added in editing.

* I guess. I've never read the thing.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Kaa on September 21, 2011, 03:58:34 PM
Dave's rant: HELL yes. A thousand times yes.

Favorite line: Thou cusseth out the Angel of the Lord.

Best. Podcastle. Story. Yet. Catapulted over all the rest to be my favorite. Laurice White's narration really did it for me (again).

It's seldom that I drive on the traffic-laden streets of Atlanta cackling aloud in my car, no doubt causing other drivers to shy away from me if they notice. The Squonk stories did it, a few others did it...and this one.

Thou cusseth out the Angel of the Lord, indeed. :)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on September 21, 2011, 04:00:39 PM
It was great watching the angels who were stuck in the "old world" ideas of religion i.e. angel of the lord says jump, subject says how high...

I'm glad you didn't say "old testament." The characters in the Hebrew bible did a lot of arguing with God and the angels. As a Jew, perhaps that's part of why I loved this story so much. The main character reminded me of early Abraham.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Listener on September 21, 2011, 06:35:32 PM
It's seldom that I drive on the traffic-laden streets of Atlanta cackling aloud in my car, no doubt causing other drivers to shy away from me if they notice.

So THAT'S who I was moving over to get away from...
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Calculating... on September 21, 2011, 08:19:22 PM
Shalom ElectricPaladin. I think that is probably why we both loved it. Most people these days seem to have actually read the old testament, rarely understanding that the old testament god gets in a lot of arguments with his chosen people. Ah, such is the burden we share. Now for some reason I feel the need to call my mother...
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Talia on September 22, 2011, 06:28:47 PM
Highly amusing. Brightened my day - just really enjoyable. Great reading too.

Nothing terribly insightful to say, but I really wanted to express my appreciation, because it brought some much-needed laughs.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: imstillreading on September 25, 2011, 01:10:28 AM
Wow - awesome story! I laughed out loud. I enjoyed the characters, good dialogue, great twists, and a fresh approach (with hope!) to old stories and old structures.
Love it.
(To all the haters out there: if you can't empathize, be someone else for a few minutes, or enjoy a story as a story, don't read fiction. Oh, and, I send love to you anyway.)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: birdless on September 27, 2011, 08:56:59 PM
Dammit I completely forgot what I was going to say here in my commentary. Oh well, I used some profanity, anyway, so I guess that compromises any validation I may have had.

Oh, I remember part of what I was going to day. It was a question about whether anything should be held sacred or not. I can't remember who said that all things should be off-limits (nothing should be held sacred, I'm sorry I couldn't find the direct quote), but I'm not sure I agree with this. For sake of argument, I'm going to skip explanations of what I hold sacred due to my faith, and just use this example: my mother was one of the most precious people who ever lived (and while I easily admit to some prejudice in this, MANY others who knew her and held no prejudice would agree with me). If someone were to write about her in a disrespectful manner, I would have major issues with that person. This is the closest thing I can think of to demonstrate the concept of something sacred in a secular setting. Hopefully the inference here is obvious: there is surely something or someone sacred to nearly everyone. Just because we have the freedom to write disrespectfully about someone doesn't mean we should, does it?

So anyway, since I said all that, I guess I'll offer my opinion on the story. I did find it humorous and well-written (in a kind of tongue-in-cheek way) and the narration was excellent. Being a Christian, I can't say that I was completely comfortable with some of the irreverence, but I would definitely classify it as "Mostly Harmless."  :)
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: jenfullmoon on September 28, 2011, 03:23:53 PM
This is now one of my favorite stories on this site. It tickles me no end and the language use cracked me up. Worked great for me, especially second person in this case :)

I also really liked the narration on this one. Gorgeous!

Favorite line: "It is not thy job to tell an angel of the LORD that thou likest not the boys."
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Destructo The Mad on September 28, 2011, 05:07:14 PM
Holy cow did I enjoy this story!  When I wasn't laughing out loud, I was chuckling to myself.  Thank God I listened to this story while driving and walking the dogs.  Wonderful story, beautifully read.

I'm coming to the realization that audiobook (or podcast) is the best format for short fiction.

Thank you again, Podcastle. 

Dave's preamble (it wasn't a rant - it was too clear, reasoned and cogent to be a rant) was an added bonus.

Bravo.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: FireTurtle on September 28, 2011, 05:17:25 PM
I think its all been said already. But, this: I want a life size oil painting of the shower scene. I'm thinking...Botticelli's Venus but with Loofa and Indignant Expression.  I NEED this. Anyone?

Loved the reading, loved the story. And yes, the line that made me laugh the loudest (they all made me smile or laugh) was the DAYCARE line. Oh my. Priceless.

And hey, Dave, props for calling it like you see it. Human beings disagree with each other- unity of thought is not part of our nature. Witness the fact that we have a forum for "discussion", not "universal and united agreement of PodCastle episode qualities". My personal creed runs much towards the "I'm really happy you believe whatever it is if you believe if you aren't a hypocrite and you aren't an asshole about it." So, you're on the side of the righteous with me.

Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Gamercow on September 28, 2011, 10:49:53 PM
Loved this one, and damned be the naysayers, for thouest hast no sense of humour. 

Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Raymond on October 01, 2011, 04:25:17 AM
Brilliant story, performed by a miracle worker, introduced by a sage.
Thank you so much for this episode of PodCastle. 
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: hallowmas on October 02, 2011, 12:16:54 PM
So yeah...like a bunch of people...long time listener, first time poster...

I have listened to Podcastle for a few years now, always with the intention of signing up for the forum and whatnot...it was this story though, this one that really spoke to me. Nagging me to express my opinion.

I.LOVED.IT!

Growing up in you're pretty typical american christian household I was taught the basics like "do unto others" and "love thy neighbor", and the moral I got from this of "if you want the change to happen, you need to be involved in the process" is one that has been instilled in me since childhood, and I loved the way the it was delivered here.

Also the way that Laurice White read this added a ton of depth, and (at the risk of being all fan-girl) I less then three'd it...and do you think an angel would smite a person if they maced it for surprising them in the shower?
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: SaturdaySportsman on October 03, 2011, 05:52:20 PM
The story itself was good but the pseudo-King James English made it a little irritating to listen to. 
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: CJGuy on October 06, 2011, 03:33:03 AM
I'll have to open my comments with several confessions:

1.  I'm a first time poster here - and I feel like such a joiner after reading all the posts and replies. But this story absolutely demanded a reaction from me.  So here I am.

2.  I grew up in a traditional, middle class Christian home where everything seemed simple and straightforward when it came to religion... until I was old enough to realize that I was irrevocably gay, and it wasn't a choice.

3.  So these days I'm gay, in a relationship, and out to my family - it's quite the controversy around the old homestead at holidays.  It was a big deal for me for oh, about twenty-plus years.  But then I had a big get-over-it which resulted in a far more balanced and healthy life for me. My sexuality doesn't define me, but it is a part of me.

4.  Prior to this story I had a bit of a crush on Dave's voice and his rant at the beginning has exacerbated that crush to the point that my partner is beginning to feel a bit jealous.  We'll work through it, but I might have to stick to Escape Pod for a few weeks.  :)  Kidding aside - thanks for the rant Dave.  It was honest, heartfelt and it set me up very well for the story that followed.

5. I laughed out loud at the same line as Spindaddy:
You had me at "Motherfu—thou sayest, "

My own favorite line is "It is not thy job to tell an angel of the Lord that thou likest not the boys".

6. I like Orson Scott Card however I'm disappointed to hear about the upcoming story with Hamlet's Dead Gay Father being evil for his gayness.  However I used to have similar feelings about Mormons because I was raised to believe that anything different from what I was taught about religion was likely cultish, misguided or heathen.  If I can change then so can OSC.

7. I really enjoy the reading of Laurice White.  Her voice is smooth and her southern accent feels like home to me.  She absolutely enhanced this story (and don't get me started about the N.K. Jemisin story she read a while back).

8. So to bring all this around to my response to the story; I loved it, which probably isn't a surprise at this point in my litany.  I loved that it made me laugh at the outset with lines like "Motherfu-thou sayest".  And I loved that it caught me by surprise with the helpful "assist" of the neighbor.  And I love the fact that it wrapped up with the idea that something can be changed for the better.  The idea that the beliefs, behaviors, assumptions and ideologies can be improved.  Dare I say corrected?  All because someone decides to help raise a child in an environment where neighbors help neighbors. And where a person can speak their mind (even unto the Angel of the Lord) and actually convince a stubborn intruder to consider being polite rather than to simply try to use their position to force things to be a certain way.  That's a nice thing to think about.

All that said; I have no idea what I think of the theology of the story, but in the end I don't think it matters.  It's a thought-provoking and funny story and I am glad it was chosen by PodCastle.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: HexD on October 17, 2011, 05:43:12 AM
Blasphemy? No.

Funny as hell? Yes.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Leslianne on November 05, 2011, 06:33:11 AM
My favorite podcastle in a good long while! And one of the best marriages of voice and text since Fiddler on Bayou Teche. Three enthusiastic thumbs up!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Unblinking on November 30, 2011, 06:22:11 PM
I didn't find the story blasphemous, but I'm not sure there's anything that I would actually label as blasphemous.  To me blasphemy is to a particular religion like grammar is to a particular dialect.  To recognize a grammar error in a language you have to be fairly fluent in it.  To recognize blasphemy, you have to be fairly fluent in or dedicated to the religion for which it is a blasphemy.  I don't think I'm devoted enough to any particular relgion to call anything blasphemous.  And even from within a religion you'd have disagreement, such as Dave not considering this one blasphemous.  I can certainly recognize that it would be considered blasphemous by some people.  (oh I see there's a separate thread for the intro comments, so I'll keep it at that for now).

I loved this story.  I love some well-placed religious irreverence in my fiction.  Of all the topics I've seen written about or written about myself the only one that consistently has been high on that list is contemplation of the nature of God and/or the afterlife.  I eat this stuff up when it's written well, and this one was written VERY well.  It makes interesting points WHILE being entertaining at the same time.  And Laurice knocked the narration out of the park.  I think this one would be a hard one to narrate because of the mixture of archaic words with modern setting and modern words, but she hit it perfectly.  I tend to like stories that put new twists on or put religion in a humorous bent.  I think that it's a valuable trait to be able to discuss your faith with good humor.  I don't think anyone is claiming that this story provides the absolute truth about how angels are, for instance, but by writing and sharing the story it opens a dialog about how they might be or should be or could be, and that in it iself is very valuable.  Even if you believe you know for a fact that angels are not like this, there's still value in being able to read the story and discuss it.

So, yeah I guess I don't have too much else to say about the story itself.    It was great, everything that I had hoped that "Hell Is the Absence of God" would've been.  I did have a few things to respond to in other comments, perhaps another post for that...



Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Unblinking on November 30, 2011, 06:23:09 PM
I have to admit, though, that I couldn't help but read this story as "the parable of the shower," as in one who shows, as in opposed to a grower - as in somebody possessed of the dubious blessing of a penis that is impressively large when flaccid (rather than simply becoming so when aroused - a more common condition).

Ha!  That's great.  I've heard that term before, but it hadn't crossed my mind here.  Now I think I'll never be able to see this title without thinking of that again.

I love the phrase "with all due respect." It doesn't really mean anything, does it? :P

To me, it absolutely means something, though not what people assume it means.  
If someone says "with all due respect, I think most people would say that taken out of context it means "I respect you, but this is why I disagree."  This is what most people think of, but usually the phrase isn't used that way.
To me, though, if someone says "with all due respect", and then shows NO respect, then this also means something.  It means that they ARE showing you the respect that they feel you are due.  Which is to say that they are telling you that you deserve no respect.  So rather than being a statement used to soften the blow of honest constructive criticism, it is used as a blunt insult.  At least that's how I interpret it.

Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Unblinking on November 30, 2011, 06:35:08 PM
Oh yeah, and on the subject of profanity, I see no reason why one cannot use profanity and also be religious.

I like my dad's viewpoint on this.  My dad's a pastor.  He doesn't swear (at least not that I've heard), but he's not offended by it when people just generally use it or when he sees it in movies or the like.  I expect he wouldn't want people to swear in church, or some situations like that, but I mean in general.  The only time I've heard him say that he was bothered by swearing was when someone seemed to be swearing specifically to get a rise out of him.  Like, someone who doesn't usually swear that much, but they see a preacher-man and they say "Let's try to get a rise out of the pastor, I bet he won't like swearing, so I'm going to try to make him uncomfortable."  That annoys him, but not because of the swearing, because of the intent.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Unblinking on December 01, 2011, 05:18:44 PM
I just remembered another thing that stood out for me:
I don't think I've ever heard the word "shame" used the way it was in this story (to refer to genitals).  Is that a common usage in some areas, or just for this story? 

That particular slang made me kind of sad--it makes me think it might be an expression used as religious connotation (as in the shame of Adam and Eve after they ate the fruit), but even from a religious point of view genitals are God-given, so what is to be ashamed of?  I mean, I'm not saying one should go naked in public spaces, but she is in the shower after all, where one is generally expected to be in the buff.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Scattercat on December 02, 2011, 01:21:29 AM
It's a southern-US colloquialism, I think.  "Hide your shame" means "get dressed," usually with overtones of disparagement or disapproval. 
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: justenjoying on January 09, 2012, 06:13:56 AM
I loved the moral to this story, but getting there while funny was fustrating. Christian tropes always bug me and this story is no exception. But to change those tropes that annoy me, we must teach them better. That is truly the long and the short of it. And I don't care who you are either, no way I'm having a baby right now.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: LaShawn on January 10, 2012, 04:15:31 PM
Yay! I'm back to catching up on my stories! And JOY! This was my first one in a long time.
So I loved this one. I want to put Dave's rant on a plaque--he's nailed down what I've been struggling with in my Christian walk for the past several years. I'm putting his words alongside my other favorite Christian SF writer, Maurice Broaddus, who did a similar rant (http://"http://mauricebroaddus.com/?p=3005") on his blog.

The story: beauteous. The reading: wonderful. The content: not blaphemous at all. In fact, I found it very close to Biblical thinking. Allow me to indulge in some Christian world-view imagining (which is not as conservative as others). This story is a retelling of john the baptist birth set in modern times. The kid born isn't the Messiah--he's justa wiseman. John the Baptist was also considered a messenger, and he was born to an older woman considered past her fertile years, Elizabeth.

I did like how the angels were baffled by the MC's refusal, and i especially like the end where the angel appears in human form to talk face to face. I would go so far as to say that this would've been God's plan all along, to get the angels to communicate in a better fashion (though i don't presume to know the mind of God, biblical or fictional) i can see the following taking place:

Angel: this girl refuses to host your child!
God: hmm...well, tell her she must
Angel: but how can she say no to you? You're God! Can't you strike her down? Or turn her into a donkey?
God: No, I'm not going to. This child must be born. Tell her that.
Angel: but she keeps saying...hold on...stand by. There's another woman who says she'll do it. An old one.
God: Perfect. Knock her up.
Angel: (blinking) but...then...why didn't we just go to her instead of the foul-mouthed one?
God: You'll see...
(9 months later)
Angel: okay, I give up. This woman whined and wailed about not being able to care for this kid, and now look at her! She may as well be the mother for all she dotes on him.
God: Yes. It's all working out very nicely.  When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.  (http://"http://youtu.be/FbinE6bx8xM")
Angel: I don't get it.
God: Perhaps you should spend more time with her. But not the flashy way you like to appear. Why not tone it down a bit?
Angel: But that's boring. I like being flashy.
God: I know. But if you tone it down a bit, you might find that she would be easier to get to know. And then the two of you can establish a relationship. You can finally learn the nature of humans and she would learn that not all angels are blathering messenger pigeons. And perhaps, even, one night, say after a bottle of wine, she may think you're even kind of cute...in a angelic sort of way, and then after several bottles, the way to another child would be paved...
Angel: Wait...what?
God: Nothing. Have fun.

My only negative comment was that I was a little turned off by the language--not because she was doing it before the Lord, but I was more bothered by the fact that she was a black woman and thus the whole M******F**** swearing thing becomes a type of stereotype. Then again, her outburst at the beginning had me cracking up the most, so perhaps I'm just in a paradoxical mood. Dammit.

And now to dive into more stories! Wheeeee!!!
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: ElectricPaladin on January 10, 2012, 04:25:12 PM
I did like how the angels were baffled by the MC's refusal, and i especially like the end where the angel appears in human form to talk face to face. I would go so far as to say that this would've been God's plan all along, to get the angels to communicate in a better fashion (though i don't presume to know the mind of God, biblical or fictional) i can see the following taking place:

Angel: this girl refuses to host your child!
God: hmm...well, tell her she must
Angel: but how can she say no to you? You're God! Can't you strike her down? Or turn her into a donkey?
God: No, I'm not going to. This child must be born. Tell her that.
Angel: but she keeps saying...hold on...stand by. There's another woman who says she'll do it. An old one.
God: Perfect. Knock her up.
Angel: (blinking) but...then...why didn't we just go to her instead of the foul-mouthed one?
God: You'll see...
(9 months later)
Angel: okay, I give up. This woman whined and wailed about not being able to care for this kid, and now look at her! She may as well be the mother for all she dotes on him.
God: Yes. It's all working out very nicely.  When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.  (http://"http://youtu.be/FbinE6bx8xM")
Angel: I don't get it.
God: Perhaps you should spend more time with her. But not the flashy way you like to appear. Why not tone it down a bit?
Angel: But that's boring. I like being flashy.
God: I know. But if you tone it down a bit, you might find that she would be easier to get to know. And then the two of you can establish a relationship. You can finally learn the nature of humans and she would learn that not all angels are blathering messenger pigeons. And perhaps, even, one night, say after a bottle of wine, she may think you're even kind of cute...in a angelic sort of way, and then after several bottles, the way to another child would be paved...
Angel: Wait...what?
God: Nothing. Have fun.

I really, really love that angle. It hadn't occurred to me, but it's officially hilarious.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: LaShawn on January 10, 2012, 05:01:54 PM
Yeah. You have a nice clash of predestination vs free will. I'm no theologian, but I like to believe my faith involves both in some way.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: herbapet on January 27, 2012, 08:13:15 PM
That was awesome.  Just finished listen, as i am new to the PodCastle.  This was very well written, and the reading was fantastic too.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: kibitzer on January 28, 2012, 05:40:09 AM
That was awesome.  Just finished listen, as i am new to the PodCastle.  This was very well written, and the reading was fantastic too.

Welcome! Stick around -- there's a heap more stories yet.
Title: Re: PC174: The Parable of the Shower
Post by: Trickster on April 12, 2012, 12:19:10 AM
Catching up on my backlog of Escape Artists stories, and this has been my favorite as of late. I'm way too lazy to post comments regularly, but I had to gush. Fantastic, funny, amazing story. I loved, loved, LOVED the narration for this! I can't remember the last time a story grabbed me from the first line and didn't let go until long after the last line, and kept me laughing all the way through. So good.   :D