Author Topic: Poll: Evolution or ID  (Read 13691 times)

Russell Nash

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on: September 18, 2007, 05:07:27 PM
Evolution says Traits evolve over time with usefel traits continuing and nonuseful traits dissappearing.  Intelligent Design says all traits were created by some greater intelligent force.



Rachel Swirsky

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Reply #1 on: September 18, 2007, 05:24:17 PM
Oy?



swdragoon

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Reply #2 on: September 18, 2007, 05:33:25 PM
err no none of the above hu?

Improvise, Adapt ,Overcome.


DKT

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Reply #3 on: September 18, 2007, 05:34:34 PM
I was going to say, "Yes."

Hey, when are we getting our pick a fight with Russell Nash thread? ;D


Russell Nash

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Reply #4 on: September 18, 2007, 05:47:33 PM
I was going to say, "Yes."

Hey, when are we getting our pick a fight with Russell Nash thread? ;D

The two are mutually exclusive.  There is no yes or both.  One says it's natural and the other says it's controled by an outside force. 

You start the thread and I'll show up.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2007, 05:50:51 PM by Russell Nash »



Mr. Tweedy

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Reply #5 on: September 18, 2007, 05:50:54 PM
I this a scientific poll?
 ;)

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swdragoon

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Reply #6 on: September 18, 2007, 05:52:37 PM
are you shure?

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Russell Nash

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Reply #7 on: September 18, 2007, 05:53:43 PM
err no none of the above hu?


Since the poll was new, I added it just for you.  Changing the poll wipes the results, so I won't be doing it again.



Russell Nash

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Reply #8 on: September 18, 2007, 05:54:40 PM
I this a scientific poll?
 ;)

This poll will tell us exactly what the people who vote want to tell us.  Precisely.




DKT

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Reply #9 on: September 18, 2007, 06:04:39 PM
I was going to say, "Yes."

Hey, when are we getting our pick a fight with Russell Nash thread? ;D

The two are mutually exclusive.  There is no yes or both.  One says it's natural and the other says it's controled by an outside force. 

You start the thread and I'll show up.

But if I believe God used evolution to create stuff, why wouldn't it be natural?


swdragoon

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Reply #10 on: September 18, 2007, 06:04:56 PM
thanks
your a hoopy frood

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Swamp

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Reply #11 on: September 18, 2007, 06:48:14 PM
Hey, when are we getting our pick a fight with Russell Nash thread? ;D

Why do we need a new thread?  We already have so many threads that constantly bring up topics that have been done to the point of nausea and slow death just for the sake of arguing with those naive, silly, religious simpletons.

Russell, we got the point months ago that evolution is your hot topic--that the thought of anyone beliving in God makes you shudder.  Can't we evolve away from this discussion?

I'm sorry for the agression and for making it personal.  You can pull this post if you want.  I am am just so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so tired of this whole debate.  I know I should just avoid threads such as this one, but it creeps into nearly every thread that I read.  I want to be part of this community, but honestly, keeping up with the forums has led to a decline of my enjoyment of Escpae Pod stories.  It's most likely just my problem; and I need a break.

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DKT

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Reply #12 on: September 18, 2007, 06:56:32 PM
Well, my idea was more of a ridiculous fun thread, like zombies and time-travel, not a serious one.  It's posted here: http://forum.escapeartists.info/index.php?topic=1069.msg15646;boardseen#new


Russell Nash

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Reply #13 on: September 18, 2007, 07:03:25 PM
Hey, when are we getting our pick a fight with Russell Nash thread? ;D
Russell, we got the point months ago that evolution is your hot topic--that the thought of anyone beliving in God makes you shudder.  Can't we evolve away from this discussion?

Look back.  I said I wouldn't argue the Evolution/ID thing again and I haven't.  Since it does come up often, I thought we'd find out what the Forums thought and maybe it could rest.  Also I have no problem with religion.  My problem is with religious people telling me I have to believe in their personal version of a god.  Their attacks on hard science are enough to make me puke.  There is no great scientist conspiracy against religion. 



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Reply #14 on: September 18, 2007, 07:12:36 PM
None of the above?!?

Is there a third way?


Russell Nash

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Reply #15 on: September 18, 2007, 07:20:18 PM
None of the above?!?

Is there a third way?

I thought after the poll was over we'd ask for clarification on that exact point.



Mr. Tweedy

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Reply #16 on: September 18, 2007, 08:01:07 PM
...those naive, silly, religious simpletons.

He he!  That makes me giggle.   :D

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DKT

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Reply #17 on: September 18, 2007, 08:49:59 PM
None of the above?!?

Is there a third way?

I thought after the poll was over we'd ask for clarification on that exact point.

Ah, so I should vote for #3...


Mr. Tweedy

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Reply #18 on: September 18, 2007, 08:55:25 PM
I wasn't at first sure which to vote for, because I do believe that adaptation occurs, resulting in greater biodiversity over time.  I don't think that every aspect of our current biodiversity is due to direct Divine intervention.

But I think the ability to adapt is a designed feature, so that got rid of my conflict.

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Swamp

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Reply #19 on: September 18, 2007, 09:03:26 PM
There is no great scientist conspiracy against religion. 

LOL  :D  Okay, you made me laugh.  Scientist conspiracy--that's pretty good.

I knew I'd regret posting before waiting a bit, and I do.  I am sorry for making it personal.  Seeing "Evolution or ID" as a new thread title just got me riled.  Now I've stepped away from the computer for a bit, had some lunch...I'm better now.  And I'm not adverse to discussing religion or science; I love both.  But the combative, dissmissive debates just grate on me.

It seems to me you have had bad experiences with religous people.  And thinking about it, I guess I too have had people "telling me I have to believe in their personal version of a god" because my beliefs varied from theirs.  To me, my faith in God is very personal, and I tire of people dismissing it.

Back on topic, as far as evolution, I believe that many things have been observed and proven scientifically.  However, when that information is extrapolated beyong the scope of observable science, and a limited viewpoint is used to explain the beginning of existence, it becomes little more than a guess based upon what scientists are able to observe right now.  I have a hard time swallowing that all life began as an accidental combination of molecules.  

I was very impressed by the Bohr quote Steve used in the outro: "...the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth."  Science is always learning, always changing, evolving if you will; new theories arise as different things are discovered and observed.  It is not perfect truth.  Scientists do the best they can with what they've got and they speculate based upon that knowledge.  But it is arrogance to assume that we have it all figured out and that we even possess the knowlegde and ability to figure it out for ourselves.  I think humility is required for the true pursuit of knowledge.

To be fair, I also feel that it is arrogant to assumre that one can gain a perfect truth by study of the Bible alone.  If we can combine and balance the spiritual power that comes from prayer and scripture study with the intellectual power that comes from the pursuit of science, all the while remaining humble, we could come much closer to determining the ultimate truth.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2007, 09:13:56 PM by kmmrlatham »

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lowky

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Reply #20 on: September 18, 2007, 10:01:38 PM
My opinion is Fundamentalists suck, whether they are religious fundies, or Atheist fundies.  Fundies refuse to budge, or accept their opinion is not the only OPINION.  Personally I think there can be an acceptance of both beliefs to some extent.  Being a born again pagan, I have to go with Midgard was created.  However nowhere in that mythology does it go into to detail on where all the animals came from that I can recall.  Midgard sprang from Ymir's eyelashes. 


SFEley

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Reply #21 on: September 18, 2007, 11:00:49 PM
Look back.  I said I wouldn't argue the Evolution/ID thing again and I haven't.  Since it does come up often, I thought we'd find out what the Forums thought and maybe it could rest.

As a general rule, the idea of One Final Thread to conclusively finish a discussion doesn't work.  Some discussions never conclude.  This is one of them.

And, I love you all, but this is also one of those examples where knowing what some participants on a forum think isn't going to make any difference on what anyone else thinks.  You're not going to change Mr. Tweedy's or FNH's mind.  They're not going to change yours.  If the discussion's getting old for anyone, just stop participating.  The world and the people in it aren't going to be any different no matter what happens here.

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swdragoon

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Reply #22 on: September 19, 2007, 12:35:53 AM
DING!!!!
WE HAVE A WINNER!
give that man a prise

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wakela

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Reply #23 on: September 19, 2007, 12:48:41 AM
Did the zombies evolve or were they created by some sort of intelligence?
If they are the result of a virus, did that evolve or was it created?  If it was created by humans does that imply ID for zombies? 

What about the zombies?
For the love of God, will someone please think of the zombies?!



Thaurismunths

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Reply #24 on: September 19, 2007, 02:17:38 AM
Did the zombies evolve or were they created by some sort of intelligence?
If they are the result of a virus, did that evolve or was it created?  If it was created by humans does that imply ID for zombies? 

What about the zombies?
For the love of God, will someone please think of the zombies?!

I'm pretty sure Zombies are the result of either ID (Intelligent Design) or UD (intentional Disaster).

How do you fight a bully that can un-make history?