Escape Artists

News:

News

ATTENTION: NEW FORUM THEME Please see here for details: http://forum.escapeartists.net/index.php?topic=13188.0

Author Topic: EP146: Edward Bear and the Very Long Walk  (Read 45538 times)

eytanz

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6109
Reply #40 on: February 26, 2008, 06:31:51 PM
Addendum: I should point out that I fully understand the very positive reactions most people had to this story. From an objective viewpoint, I share most of them. It was just hard for me to connect emotionally to it, for the reasons explained above.



Jhite

  • Palmer
  • **
  • Posts: 47
    • Great Hites
Reply #41 on: February 26, 2008, 09:08:06 PM
I'm not sure why the author of this story choose to use Pooh as his main character - there could be a variety of reasons, some better than others. But in doing so, he set himself up to a comparison against a source he cannot best, or even improve. I'm not upset - if I were to be upset at the commodification of Pooh I'd have far greater targets to be angry at than this story. I'm just unimpressed. Someone just tried to repackage a part of my childhood and hand it back to me with a more sophisticated, more adult finish. But, just like in the books' ending, there's a place inside me where my childhood still lives, and that place is always going to be more attractive than this new packaging.

     I think, and this is my humble opinion, that many authors, myself included, look for short cuts.  That is the long and short of it.  You, as an author, have say 10k works to build a world, build a set of characters in that world, and tell a story.  The nature of sci/fi is that all of those things may be unfamiliar to the reader, so you have to "spend" some of your words on explaining these things to the reader.  If you borrow your setting, a character, or a plot from another source you can avoid some of this.  I have to say at this point that I think that it is a measure of a good Sci/fi author by how little of this he/she has to do and still let us see a world and characters and a plot that don't look like cardboard cut outs.

****** I took out most of what I originally posted  because I sounded preachy  but here is the gist*******

Blah Blah blah FanFic Blah blah blah Pale Copy of the original blah blah blah Movies not a good as books, blah blah blah could have done better. blah blah blah!

     I was able to enjoy the story because I looked past the references to pooh and thought about the rest of it.  As my first post suggests I was more worried about the native life on the planet than I was about what this bear happened to be called.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2008, 09:36:59 PM by Jhite »

Captain James T. Kirk
I'm sorry I can't here you over the sound of how awesome I am
http://GreatHites.blogspot.com


Anarkey

  • Meen Pie
  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 703
  • ...depends a good deal on where you want to get to
Reply #42 on: February 26, 2008, 09:16:47 PM
Was it the cute allegory bit that bothered you, Anarkey?  I can tell you didn't like the story, but I'm not 100% sure why.

No, not the allegory so much.  The bit that bothered me was that I felt the bear was portrayed over-emotionally, with language that pandered to triteness and sentimentality (for that matter, the ship AI moaning about her terrible mistake also set my teeth to the very edge.  I wanted to reach into the story, smack her, then tell her to stop acting so hysterical).  Why does Edward hope?  Why does he need to be assured of his value in the world?  Why is he afraid of death (the children's, his own)? I don't get it.  I think I was supposed to be all fuzzed up (ha!) about the teddy bear factor (plusextramegaplus if I noticed that the bear was Pooh) and I think the author threw out those lines thinking they were enough to make me give a damn instead of making the bear an actual for real character with any kind of complexity. 

The natives critters also bugged me.  Guh, talk about noble savage squared.

Dear Authors: 
your noble savages are neither noble nor savage.  Cut it out.  Write real characters who happen to be of a race/species/whatever because I can't take any more of the stereotype cookie cuttering.  Thanks!  Kisses, Anarkey.

There was a moment in the story that completely worked for me.  It was the moment when the bear is wired in, has full comprehension of the plan and the need for it and realizes he must toss three quarters of that info out because he can't retain it (though apparently throwing out the 'there, there, you're a hero, everything's ok' subroutine in order to save space does not occur to him).  That moment was understated and really walloped me (it's laced right into one of my storytelling kinks, too, the hard choices one) instead of sledgehammery and sappy like the opening and closing sequences.  If the whole story had been like that moment in emotional tenor and character illumination, I might have liked it better.  I also might have liked it better if I ever thought the bear was in any real danger of failing to complete the mission, but I didn't buy any of the close calls.

I also had a critical failure of funny, which I think this story needed if it was going to be about Pooh.

As far as I am concerned, the ending of "The House at Pooh Corner" was, and still is, one of the most touching and poignent endings in all literature. It is as bittersweet and tragic as the end of childhood always is.

The ending of this story, while touching, doesn't come anywhere near. Maybe it's just me, but self-sacrifice isn't nearly as universal or tragic as the inevitability of leaving one's childhood behind.

YES.  Yes, yes, yes, a thousand times yes!  It is not just you.  You nailed it, eytanz, better than I could have said it. 

I'm not sure why the author of this story choose to use Pooh as his main character - there could be a variety of reasons, some better than others. But in doing so, he set himself up to a comparison against a source he cannot best, or even improve.

Right on.  He invites comparisons that are unlikely to go favorably his way.  I have this same problem with remakes of old songs.  Nine times out of ten I'm like,"Uh.  Ok.  But why?"

Of course the one time out of ten I'm like OMG THIS IS AWESOME (They Might Be Giants' cover of "Istanbul not Constantinople" frex).  But this story was definitely in the nine times out of ten category.

P.S.  I also agree with eytanz that the Eekhout story did a better job of being referential.  It was also better at successfully engaging me emotionally.  Have I mentioned that I love Eekhout?  His stories make my heart go pitter patter.  See?  I'm not a complete hater.

Winner Nash's 1000th member betting pool + Thaurismunths' Free Rice Contest!


DKT

  • Friendly Neighborhood
  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 4980
  • PodCastle is my Co-Pilot
    • Psalms & Hymns & Spiritual Noir
Reply #43 on: February 26, 2008, 09:44:55 PM
Thanks, Anarkey and eytanz.  I totally get where you're coming from.  I haven't read all the Milne stuff, so maybe I don't have the same baggage, but I understand your perspective.  (I'm also starting to wonder if you two are split personalities ;))

     I think, and this is my humble opinion, that many authors, myself included, look for short cuts.  That is the long and short of it.  You, as an author, have say 10k works to build a world, build a set of characters in that world, and tell a story.  The nature of sci/fi is that all of those things may be unfamiliar to the reader, so you have to "spend" some of your words on explaining these things to the reader.  If you borrow your setting, a character, or a plot from another source you can avoid some of this.  I have to say at this point that I think that it is a measure of a good Sci/fi author by how little of this he/she has to do and still let us see a world and characters and a plot that don't look like cardboard cut outs.

I don't know, Jhite.  I think you're overlooking something.  I don't think the author used the Pooh Bear thing so much as a shortcut as he thought it would be fun story.


DKT

  • Friendly Neighborhood
  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 4980
  • PodCastle is my Co-Pilot
    • Psalms & Hymns & Spiritual Noir
Reply #44 on: February 26, 2008, 09:47:14 PM
****** I took out most of what I originally posted  because I sounded preachy  but here is the gist*******

Blah Blah blah FanFic Blah blah blah Pale Copy of the original blah blah blah Movies not a good as books, blah blah blah could have done better. blah blah blah!

Yeah, I was going to post about that, too, then realized you took it out.  Pretty much, my arguement was it's not Fanfic (not there's anything wrong with that) anymore than blah blah blah A.I. blah blah blah Pinnochio.  :)


Darwinist

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 701
Reply #45 on: February 26, 2008, 09:54:05 PM
Of course the one time out of ten I'm like OMG THIS IS AWESOME (They Might Be Giants' cover of "Istanbul not Constantinople" frex).  But this story was definitely in the nine times out of ten category.

Aimee Mann's "Baby Blue"

Back to Pooh discussion..........

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.    -  Carl Sagan


Jhite

  • Palmer
  • **
  • Posts: 47
    • Great Hites
Reply #46 on: February 26, 2008, 09:58:34 PM
****** I took out most of what I originally posted  because I sounded preachy  but here is the gist*******

Blah Blah blah FanFic Blah blah blah Pale Copy of the original blah blah blah Movies not a good as books, blah blah blah could have done better. blah blah blah!

Yeah, I was going to post about that, too, then realized you took it out.  Pretty much, my arguement was it's not Fanfic (not there's anything wrong with that) anymore than blah blah blah A.I. blah blah blah Pinnochio.  :)

I had hoped I pulled it out before anyone saw it.   

I don't really think it was FanFic but borderline enough that I thought about it. But also borderline enough that I was able to ignore that part of it and think about important things like the prime directive.  "Something you can transplant?  You boys have got to get this straight, there can be so much as a microbe of the show is off."  Relating back to my first post.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2008, 10:00:58 PM by Jhite »

Captain James T. Kirk
I'm sorry I can't here you over the sound of how awesome I am
http://GreatHites.blogspot.com


eytanz

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6109
Reply #47 on: February 26, 2008, 10:02:44 PM
I'm not sure why the author of this story choose to use Pooh as his main character - there could be a variety of reasons, some better than others.

     I think, and this is my humble opinion, that many authors, myself included, look for short cuts.

That's certainly one of the possibilities, but I'm inclined to be more generous to the author and think that there was more to it than that.

Quote from: Jhite
     I was able to enjoy the story because I looked past the references to pooh and thought about the rest of it.  As my first post suggests I was more worried about the native life on the planet than I was about what this bear happened to be called.

I was concerned about that too (see my earlier post on the topic). I have a feeling that you and I were thinking about while the story was going on is a symptom of the fact that it didn't entirely work for us, not a cause, though.

(for that matter, the ship AI moaning about her terrible mistake also set my teeth to the very edge.  I wanted to reach into the story, smack her, then tell her to stop acting so hysterical).

I didn't think of that before, but that's a really good point. Especially since the recap of the events implied that the AI didn't really make a mistake so much as there was a mechanical failure she could not control, which triggered a cascade of unforseeable disasters. Unless the AI also designed the ship, I can't see why she should blame herself. And who programs an AI that will have emotional meltdowns in the first place?

Maybe it was some sort of subtle trigger for the bear's programming - maybe the bear is supposed to react in a certain way to crying children and the AI needed to act that way to manipulate him into agreeing to help her/it. But if so, it wasn't very clear from the story.





Jhite

  • Palmer
  • **
  • Posts: 47
    • Great Hites
Reply #48 on: February 26, 2008, 10:31:44 PM
Quote from: eytanz
Quote

I'm not sure why the author of this story choose to use Pooh as his main character - there could be a variety of reasons, some better than others.

     I think, and this is my humble opinion, that many authors, myself included, look for short cuts.

That's certainly one of the possibilities, but I'm inclined to be more generous to the author and think that there was more to it than that.

Just for my own curiosity what do you think the author might have been trying to do.  Maybe right their own version of the pooh story?  If they where it didn't really work as you and other have pointed out.  That is why I said it was a short cut.  I have a ready-made  character that everyone already knows the history of, check now move on to the story.

Quote
was concerned about that too (see my earlier post on the topic). I have a feeling that you and I were thinking about while the story was going on is a symptom of the fact that it didn't entirely work for us, not a cause, though.
I know I was distracted by this all through the story enough that I tuned out the annoying talk about pooh, but I guess I really didn't think of it like that.  I thought it was intended to just make me think about other things.  (subliminally you want a coke and a box of popcorn) if you know what I mean.

Captain James T. Kirk
I'm sorry I can't here you over the sound of how awesome I am
http://GreatHites.blogspot.com


CGFxColONeill

  • Matross
  • ****
  • Posts: 241
Reply #49 on: February 26, 2008, 10:43:22 PM
The ending of this story, while touching, doesn't come anywhere near. Maybe it's just me, but self-sacrifice isn't nearly as universal or tragic as the inevitability of leaving one's childhood behind.

also maybe the self-sacrifice is overused as a literary or film plot?
just a thought

Overconfidence - Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure you could survive the odds beating you.

I am not sure if Life is passing me by or running me over


DKT

  • Friendly Neighborhood
  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 4980
  • PodCastle is my Co-Pilot
    • Psalms & Hymns & Spiritual Noir
Reply #50 on: February 26, 2008, 10:53:22 PM
Quote from: eytanz
Quote

I'm not sure why the author of this story choose to use Pooh as his main character - there could be a variety of reasons, some better than others.

     I think, and this is my humble opinion, that many authors, myself included, look for short cuts.

That's certainly one of the possibilities, but I'm inclined to be more generous to the author and think that there was more to it than that.

Just for my own curiosity what do you think the author might have been trying to do.  Maybe right their own version of the pooh story?  If they where it didn't really work as you and other have pointed out.  That is why I said it was a short cut.  I have a ready-made  character that everyone already knows the history of, check now move on to the story.

It's not really aimed at me, I still think he thought it was just a fun idea, to have a story about Winnie the Pooh in space.  And who knows?  He might've been feeling a bit nostalgic at the time, too. 

The ending of this story, while touching, doesn't come anywhere near. Maybe it's just me, but self-sacrifice isn't nearly as universal or tragic as the inevitability of leaving one's childhood behind.

also maybe the self-sacrifice is overused as a literary or film plot?
just a thought

Maybe, but for me it's not so much whether or not it's overdone, as much as whether or not it's done/executed well.  However, there seems to be some debate on that subject :) 


Swamp

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 2229
    • Journey Into... podcast
Reply #51 on: February 26, 2008, 11:34:26 PM
Just for my own curiosity what do you think the author might have been trying to do.  Maybe right their own version of the pooh story?  If they where it didn't really work as you and other have pointed out.  That is why I said it was a short cut.  I have a ready-made  character that everyone already knows the history of, check now move on to the story.

I think the author had an affinity for Winnie-the-Pooh, as shown in the Pooh references down to the imitation of writing style.  I think it was meant as an homage to a loved character.  Of course I have no way of knowing for sure.  Obviously, it didn't work for everyone, but it did for me.

The natives critters also bugged me.  Guh, talk about noble savage squared.

I picked up on the noble savage schtick, but overlooked it because I liked to rest of the story.

I also had a critical failure of funny, which I think this story needed if it was going to be about Pooh.

I agree that there was a lack of Pooh-associated humor with the story, though the circumstances were grim.  I think the parrot people were supposed to be the comic relief, and succeed mildly at first (due to Steve's production), but soon fell flat.

As far as I am concerned, the ending of "The House at Pooh Corner" was, and still is, one of the most touching and poignent endings in all literature. It is as bittersweet and tragic as the end of childhood always is.

The ending of this story, while touching, doesn't come anywhere near. Maybe it's just me, but self-sacrifice isn't nearly as universal or tragic as the inevitability of leaving one's childhood behind.

I cannot argue with you on that.  You speak the truth.  Nothing has come close to giving me the feelings I get at the end of the book (even more so now as an adult).  However, I still enjoyed this story, which I view as a tribute rather than an attempt to replace the original.

Facehuggers don't have heads!

Come with me and Journey Into... another fun podcast


CGFxColONeill

  • Matross
  • ****
  • Posts: 241
Reply #52 on: February 26, 2008, 11:36:47 PM
Maybe, but for me it's not so much whether or not it's overdone, as much as whether or not it's done/executed well.  However, there seems to be some debate on that subject :) 

that was my intent w/ the comment it is so over used that in order for it to work it must be well done/ executed
sorry for the lack of clarity on my part

also when I say I did not like it I am not going after the narration it can only be as good as the story that is being narrated
Steve you should do many more episodes

Overconfidence - Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure you could survive the odds beating you.

I am not sure if Life is passing me by or running me over


wakela

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 779
    • Mr. Wake
Reply #53 on: February 27, 2008, 12:26:40 AM
Disclaimer: I feel no particular affinity for Winnie the Pooh.

I enjoyed listening to the story, but it could have been better.  I'm also surprised at what a positive response it got.  Bravery was mentioned several times, but Edward doesn't seem particularly brave or cowardly.  He is too ignorant of the danger to be truly brave.  He is also too ignorant to be making a real sacrifice.   Frodo and Sam at least had some inkling they wouldn't be coming home, and at one point they knew it without a doubt.  Edward doesn't seem to struggle with this.  He doesn't seem to struggle with anything.  He didn't even struggle with leaving the nursery even though he said he would.  Maybe that is Pooh, but it's not dramatic tension.

The twist on this hero's journey is largely cosmetic.  It would have been more interesting if Edward's nature as a robot toy bear gave him unique limitations or abilities.   I'm surprised that he was even able to attack anything.  Why would you design a children's toy that is remotely capable of violence?  Why would a robot need a sub-brain to comfort it as it dies?  Some of you probably think I am missing the point, but as a science fiction fan, these things break my suspension of disbelief, and they frustrate me because a more interesting story would have resulted in their consideration.  OK, the monsters have your wagon.  How do you get it back without attacking them?

This came across as more ranty than I intended.  I DID enjoyed listening to the story, and I cared what happened.  But there was a much better story that could have come from this idea.





gelee

  • Lochage
  • *****
  • Posts: 521
  • It's a missile, boy.
Reply #54 on: February 27, 2008, 01:21:47 PM
Great story, and very moving.  Certainly one of my favorite EP's to date.
I should say that I didn't really get any exposure to "children's lit" as a child, so I have no particular attachment to Milne's work.  For me, this story stands on it's own.
I'm also a little shocked at the negative reactions to this story.  Wow, I thought I was cynical.



Darwinist

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 701
Reply #55 on: February 27, 2008, 02:30:00 PM
Great story, and very moving.  Certainly one of my favorite EP's to date.
I should say that I didn't really get any exposure to "children's lit" as a child, so I have no particular attachment to Milne's work.  For me, this story stands on it's own.
I'm also a little shocked at the negative reactions to this story.  Wow, I thought I was cynical.


I am also shocked at all the negative reactions.  I really, really liked this one. But I tend to like most of the EP stories, and not have much in the way of strong negative feelings towards them.  (Exceptions being Acepheous Dreams and that steampunk story from last fall).  After reading some of the commentary about this episode I feel like a bit of a simpleton.  While listening I just don't nitpick that much.  I think a lot of the people that liked it said so briefly while those with negative feelings felt the need to write more to explain their points of view. 

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.    -  Carl Sagan


Anarkey

  • Meen Pie
  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 703
  • ...depends a good deal on where you want to get to
Reply #56 on: February 27, 2008, 04:19:08 PM
I am also shocked at all the negative reactions.  I really, really liked this one. But I tend to like most of the EP stories, and not have much in the way of strong negative feelings towards them.  (Exceptions being Acepheous Dreams and that steampunk story from last fall).  After reading some of the commentary about this episode I feel like a bit of a simpleton.  While listening I just don't nitpick that much.  I think a lot of the people that liked it said so briefly while those with negative feelings felt the need to write more to explain their points of view. 

For the record, I can comment just as volubly on pieces I have loved as on pieces I disdain.  Often someone beats me to the punch on the specific parts I love (*cough* eytanz *cough*), however, and I try not to post too much in the 'me too' vein, so that may affect the balance of my posts.   

I also don't post in an attempt to throwdown intellectually, or make anyone feel like a simpleton.  OTOH, I refuse to apologize for the breadth of my vocabulary, or my expressions of critical thought.  Been there, done that, quite finished, thank you.  I post primarily because I'm interested, either in the stories themselves or in the reactions to them (and I include my own reaction to stories in the set of things I find interesting).

I have a strong lit crit background, and analyzing stories is part of the fun of it for me.  I can enjoy stories at face value, without analysis, sure, but I get deeper enjoyment out of things I can take apart and think about, and I get the deepest enjoyment out of stories that engage me *both* intellectually and emotionally.  I am not best pleased by fiction that requires turning my brain off to enjoy it.  The desire to deconstruct and examine the parts is a basic geek drive, and I'm surprised to find it scorned as 'nitpicking' and/or 'missing the point' (in another thread).

Your statement that you don't nitpick while listening is valid for most listeners, I believe.  I see fewer flaws in stories that engage me than in ones that fail to suck me in.  Debra Doyle, at the Viable Paradise workshop, calls this phenomenon "people don't count rivets on a moving train".  In stories that I don't like, often the train just isn't moving fast enough, and I start counting rivets, and noticing they're not quite right.  This is still, as far as I'm concerned, an error on the author's part.  They have, or should have, control of the pacing of the story.

That said, I don't think slow train motion was the problem for me in this story.  As I believe I stated upthread, the story is fine from a technical execution standpoint (unlike Friction, which I think had logical holes big enough to swallow small suns, which I perhaps wouldn't have noticed had things moved along at a better pace).  After thinking (and posting) about it, I think it's of a type of story that just doesn't connect with me.  When I tried to think of other stories of its type, I came up with Eugie Foster's Penguin Balloon story (what was it called?), which I also hated but at the time I heard it, I felt that was maybe because of the baby-voiced reading it got (though I usually like Mur's readings).  And it's not that I hate Eugie's stuff, either, because her Pseudopod story "Oranges, Lemons and Thou Beside Me" is in my top three favorite Pseudopod's EVER.  So, in essence, my 'nitpicking' is more like my exploration, out loud and in public, of elements in storytelling that work (or don't) for me.  Apparently, toys are a hard sell for me, and the author will have to work hard against my prejudices to make me like a story intended for adults with a toy as protagonist (I can think of plenty of examples I like in children's lit.).  Now I know more about what I like in stories, and that should help me find more stuff I like and avoid stuff that I don't like.  To me this is a good thing, achieved by my thinking critically about why I didn't like this particular story. 

Winner Nash's 1000th member betting pool + Thaurismunths' Free Rice Contest!


Listener

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 3187
  • I place things in locations which later elude me.
    • Various and Sundry Items of Interest
Reply #57 on: February 27, 2008, 04:20:43 PM
Your statement that you don't nitpick while listening is valid for most listeners, I believe.  I see fewer flaws in stories that engage me than in ones that fail to suck me in.  Debra Doyle, at the Viable Paradise workshop, calls this phenomenon "people don't count rivets on a moving train".  In stories that I don't like, often the train just isn't moving fast enough, and I start counting rivets, and noticing they're not quite right.  This is still, as far as I'm concerned, an error on the author's part.  They have, or should have, control of the pacing of the story.

I heart Debra Doyle & James Macdonald.  I really wish they'd finish their Arekhon trilogy.

End of sidebar.

"Farts are a hug you can smell." -Wil Wheaton

Blog || Quote Blog ||  Written and Audio Work || Twitter: @listener42


eytanz

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 6109
Reply #58 on: February 27, 2008, 04:36:45 PM
I am also shocked at all the negative reactions.  I really, really liked this one. But I tend to like most of the EP stories, and not have much in the way of strong negative feelings towards them.  (Exceptions being Acepheous Dreams and that steampunk story from last fall).  After reading some of the commentary about this episode I feel like a bit of a simpleton.  While listening I just don't nitpick that much.  I think a lot of the people that liked it said so briefly while those with negative feelings felt the need to write more to explain their points of view. 

I'm a natural-born (or maybe bred, lets not get into nature vs. nurture here) nitpicker. It's what comes naturally to me, and, as an academic, it's what I've been trained to do for a living. Just like Anarkey, for me analyzing the stories is part of the fun.

What I find interesting is the impression that the nitpicks give. I didn't have a negative reaction to the story. I had a positive reaction to one. Just not a purely positive one. And, when writing about it, I chose to write about the less positive parts, because I think those are more interesting. That's not always the case - I just requested a thread for "The Dream Factory" specifically so I can highlight the one overwhelmingly positive aspect in an otherwise negative response to a story - but it often is. And in this case, I think it was important to me to highlight the problems I've had with the story's premise because much of the prior response was overwhlemingly positive (Anarkey's post above mine being the exception). It's a lot more interesting to try to engage in a discussion with people I disagree with than to discuss things with people I agree with, at least until the point where the discussion shifts into an argument.

So, my post may have focused on the negative aspects, which might give the impression I had a negative opinion. That is, however, not the case.

Beyond that, the last thing I want to do is make anyone feel like a simpleton. I enjoy sharing an opinion, and I enjoy discussing it. But there is nothing about either of those facts that makes my opinions more valid or important than the opinions of people who are not as detailed or involved in writing about them.  I'm nitpicky and verbose, that's my style; but my opinions are still nothing more and nothing less than opinions, and no better or worse than those of people with less nitpicky or less verbose writing styles.



Swamp

  • Hipparch
  • ******
  • Posts: 2229
    • Journey Into... podcast
Reply #59 on: February 27, 2008, 05:04:19 PM
I'm also a little shocked at the negative reactions to this story.  Wow, I thought I was cynical.

I am also shocked at all the negative reactions.  I really, really liked this one.

I'm glad you both enjoyed the story.  So did I.  However, I think these comments fall under the category of critiquing the critique, which Steve has warned against multiple times.  It's not a big deal, but if you want someone to see your opinion as valid, why not extend that same courtesy to others, especially regarding literature.

If I learned anything from the flash contest last year, it is that a given story will always be viewed differently by its audience.  And that's a good thing.  We learn from each other.  Why are you shocked that someone has a different opinion that you do?  Even if you really, really, really, really like something, that doesn't gaurantee eveyone else will.  I loved this story, as did many others.  Anarkey strongly disliked it; eytanz highlighted negative points about it.  So?   I have learned from their explanations as to why they disliked it, and I took a second look at why I liked it so much.  The bottom line is that I still love the story, but understand where it fell short for them.  That is what a forum is for.  I have learned it is best to simply share my opinions and observations and let everyone else do the same.

Then again, here I am critiquing the critique of the critique.  Now I have probably started a sideline discussion.  I just wanted to share my thoughts on what I have learned in order to enjoy these forums for myself. 

Back to comments about Edward...
« Last Edit: February 27, 2008, 05:09:27 PM by kmmrlatham »

Facehuggers don't have heads!

Come with me and Journey Into... another fun podcast