Author Topic: EP156: Distant Replay  (Read 39622 times)

Russell Nash

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on: May 02, 2008, 08:36:47 AM
EP156: Distant Replay

2008 Hugo Nominee!

By Mike Resnick.
Read by Steve Anderson (of SGA Creative and Great Tales Live).
First appeared in Asimov’s Science Fiction, April/May 2007.

“Let me show you,” I said, pulling out my wallet. I took my Deirdre’s photo out and handed it to her.

“It’s uncanny,” she said, studying the picture. “We even sort of wear our hair the same way. When was this taken?”

“Forty-seven years ago.”

“Is she dead?”

I nodded.


Rated PG. Contains mature themes and wistfulness.


Referenced Sites:
2008 Hugo Awards
“First of May” by Jonathan Coulton (Not work-safe)



Listen to this week’s Escape Pod!
« Last Edit: May 02, 2008, 09:35:22 AM by Russell Nash »



Sylvan

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Reply #1 on: May 02, 2008, 12:20:49 PM
There's something about Mr. Resnick's stories when he writes dialogue.

I found myself hearing different faces, as it were; the choice of words -not just the reader's voices- constructed different images in my mind for each character.  And, yes, I'm sure I've been to that Italian restaurant, before.  I just can't remember where.

As with "Down Memory Lane" there was a melancholy to this story.  It was one of those fantasy tales that didn't need explanation as to the "how" and "why" of it, only that it was happening.  I don't know what I'd do if I met an echo of my life but I'd probably have less to talk about than Walter.

"Do you know 'Electra Woman & Dyna Girl'?"

I'd probably just get a blank stare since the pop culture of anyone that much significantly younger than myself would be radically different.  :)  Walter's just lucky that he and his wife both loved things that are timeless.

In the end it was an enchanting story and really put death in its place as something neither comforting nor scary:  just part of a process and -appropriately- another opportunity to make an impact on the world.  After this, I almost look forward to the years ahead with the same curiosity as I did when I was a teenager.

Mr. Resnick certainly has earned his place on my bookshelf.

Yours,
Sylvan (Dave)



Darwinist

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Reply #2 on: May 02, 2008, 01:00:13 PM
I remember reading this in Asimov's so I was pumped when I saw it on my I-Tunes list.  Love the story and I thought the reading was really well done.  A great listen.  Looking forward to the next Hugo nominee!     

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.    -  Carl Sagan


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Reply #3 on: May 02, 2008, 02:54:53 PM
  I am constantly impressed with Mr. Resnick's range. A lot of writers seem to tell stories in the same style over and over, but Resnick's stories are of such a wide variety. It's hard to think that the same person wrote this story, "Barnaby in Exile", "The Big Guy", "The Boy Who Yelled "Dragon"",and "Frankie the Spook". I wish I had that kind of flexibility in my writing style.

  Much like with "The Big Guy" the ending was predictable, but it didn't matter. It was a good story, and a pleasant listen, and I'll take quality over originality any day... at least until I come up with an original idea myself.

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Reply #4 on: May 02, 2008, 03:53:15 PM
Well, it has finally happened Mr. Eley, you put up a a story that made me cry.  At work.  During the course of the story I couldn't shake the feeling that I was talking to my grandfather. This story is now tied to Friction as my favorite.  Can't wait until next week.



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Reply #5 on: May 02, 2008, 03:56:07 PM
I really enjoyed this story.  Everytime I second-guessed what one of the characters were doing, or how they would react to each other, they second-guessed it too.  Steve Anderson's reading was also a big plus.  He sounded so tired and raw in this piece.  Occasionally, I thought there were places where the world weariness was too thick, where it should have been tempered with something else, but overall the reading made this story for me.

If I had a criticism of the story itself, it'd be this: never doubting who you should spend the life with, or if you made the right choices?  That's really pushing the boundaries of magical realism for me.  I've heard people say it before, and I assume that it does happen, but I don't buy that it's the only road to happiness in a relationship, or that it should be considered the standard.  I'm not advocating that you should sell yourself short as Deidre almost did -- I'm just saying a lifetime relationship is probably going to have some rough times thrown as well as all the good stuff. 

That said, a very good story.  The Hugos are going to be interesting this year :) 


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Reply #6 on: May 02, 2008, 06:01:40 PM
I think I've finally put my finger on what doesn't work for me about most Resnick stories.  He sucks at Science Fiction.  I never buy into whatever futuristic hook he puts into his stories.  If he has a robot in his stories, it's not realistic as a robot, and the implications of robots in society are always laughable. 

This time, there was no attempt at Science Fiction, and thus I really had no problems with the story. 



qwints

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Reply #7 on: May 02, 2008, 06:19:48 PM
Wow, the Hugo stories this year are amazing. This is hands down my choice for best non-sf escape pod ever ;). Maybe it's because, ever since my grandmother's death, my grandfather has had a really hard time, but I was crying at the end when the narrator figured out his purpose. This is one of my top 5 escape pods and maybe even my top 10 short stories ever.

The lamp flared and crackled . . .
And Nevyrazimov felt better.


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Reply #8 on: May 02, 2008, 06:42:14 PM
This story is Resnik at his best, and his best is damn good indeed. It hit all the right notes, and, while not entirely unpredictable, it was not about surprising anyone, it was just about a touching tale well told.



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Reply #9 on: May 03, 2008, 04:01:28 AM
I loved this one.  If iTunes let me star-rate more current episodes the way I can rate the ones I've downloaded outside of the feed, I'd give this one a five (I rarely give fives; I think the only one I've given a five to previously is Mur Lafferty's "I Look Forward to Remembering You".)

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mike-resnick

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Reply #10 on: May 03, 2008, 07:50:09 AM
I thought you might like to know the genesis of this. I always play music when I'm writing. I was working on a different story when suddenly Frank Sinatra's version of "When or Where" came on. You've probably heard the lyrics, at least if you've voted in a few elections: "I feel that we have met and danced like this before/The dress you are wearing you were wearing then/But I can't remember where or when..."
It was heartbreakingly beautiful and nostalgic -- it always is, but it seemed like I was hearing it for
the first time -- and I said to myself, "Hell, there's a better story hidden in there than the one I'm working on" -- and before I'd knocked off for the night, I'd written "Distant Replay".

-- Mike Resnick



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Reply #11 on: May 03, 2008, 08:33:25 AM
Wow, that floored me.  Great story, beautifully told, beautifully read.

It had some sad, inside-out personal significance to me.  I lost my fiancee (who loved Austen and hated the Brontes, among other eerie similarities) to sudden disease when she was 22 and I 21.  I think I feel both sides of the story; on the one hand, I know Deirdre's (and young Wally's) youthful aniety of the clock ticking on a life that doesn't turn out quite how you'd expected, and at the same time I do feel Wally's pain of having lost someone so very deeply loved and so much the center of one's world.

Sorry, that had nothing to do with the story, I just had to get it out.  But anyways, wonderful story, with the perfect balance of melancholy and hope (at least half of the tears at the end were tears of joy for the younger iterations' possible future together).



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Reply #12 on: May 03, 2008, 02:31:00 PM
I sent a twitter, I sent an email, I sent a voicemail, and now I'm sending a forum post because I can't say it enough:

This story is a masterwork.

Every time I came to a realization, every time I had an epiphany, WALTER HAD IT TOO... at that very moment.  The pacing was spot-on.  I laughed, I cried, I fell down... it changed my life.

Seriously.

The combination of masterful words and masterful reading was, in my humble opinion, the best EP ever.



ajames

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Reply #13 on: May 03, 2008, 08:28:32 PM
The high praise on the boards makes me wonder if I shouldn't listen to this one once more. I liked it well enough when I listened to it, but it didn't make me laugh, or cry, or fall down, or change my life. To me it was  a fairly cool idea told very well by the author and the reader, but it didn't really strike a chord.

Maybe if I listen to it with my wife instead of at the gym it will strike me differently.

Looking forward to more Hugo's!



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Reply #14 on: May 03, 2008, 10:28:01 PM
I thought you might like to know the genesis of this. I always play music when I'm writing. I was working on a different story when suddenly Frank Sinatra's version of "When or Where" came on. You've probably heard the lyrics, at least if you've voted in a few elections: "I feel that we have met and danced like this before/The dress you are wearing you were wearing then/But I can't remember where or when..."
It was heartbreakingly beautiful and nostalgic -- it always is, but it seemed like I was hearing it for
the first time -- and I said to myself, "Hell, there's a better story hidden in there than the one I'm working on" -- and before I'd knocked off for the night, I'd written "Distant Replay".

-- Mike Resnick

I love that song (here's a free listen to the Sinatra version, and one to our favorite, by Harry Connick, Jr.)

It makes it even better that it inspired such a beautiful story.

<Edit:forgot my closing paren :( >
« Last Edit: May 04, 2008, 04:15:01 AM by Tango Alpha Delta »

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contra

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Reply #15 on: May 03, 2008, 10:30:13 PM
I  liked the story and I had a tear in my eye at the end.

It reminded me of an anime, 'Air' (awesome stuff.  only the second once ever to have me on the floor is tears at the ending), whish turns out to be about reincarnation and souls being destined to stay together and such.

I liked that he saw it as fate that he got together with her; though i'd have liked it to go into how the two of them met; ie was he introduced to her by an eccentric old man or woman.  But that could be going into it too far.

Its another way to make sure that you carry on forever, cause another version of yourself happiness.  Your soul or body gonig on forever with your perfect partner.

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Reply #16 on: May 04, 2008, 03:41:30 AM
I think I've finally put my finger on what doesn't work for me about most Resnick stories.  He sucks at Science Fiction.  I never buy into whatever futuristic hook he puts into his stories.  If he has a robot in his stories, it's not realistic as a robot, and the implications of robots in society are always laughable. 

This time, there was no attempt at Science Fiction, and thus I really had no problems with the story. 

Have you read Santiago? That is one on my all time favorite Resnick stories, and one of my all time favorite sci-fi books, even fiction in general books that I have read. I haven't read many others of his books, but that one is great.

I liked this story. It's good to know I'm not the only who who can get a bit teary eyed listening to my iPod, but I don't mind laughing out loud at things no one else can hear as I work, but getting seen crying for no apparent reason, that would be annoying {:0p Near the end, I guessed what was going to happen, but I felt the story lead up to this and there was foreshadowing and not just plain obviousness. I posted some stuff about guessing story ending on this thread on the Drabblecast forums, so I wont say it all again here.
I don't find the story believable, doesn't seem like it would ever happen. Normally, I tend to enjoy totally unbelievable situations less, but if in the world it is set in it makes sense, I enjoy it more. In this story, there is no real 'sense' to it, things just happen for no reason, but because of the way the story was told and how mush I liked the characters, I never got bugged by the story. Besides, anything can happen in fantasy.

I've never been a huge fantasy fan, but with the exposure I'm getting via audiobooks, podcast(les) I've been listening too and so forth, I'm finding I like it more than I thought I would. Sci-Fi so many times focuses on things and situations, fantasy so many times seems to focus on people. In Santiago, as I recall while writing this, I remember the people more that the situations or technology, where as in my other favorite sci-fi, I seem to recall the situations more.

I've been trying out other fiction podcasts and haven't had too much luck, lots of the stories were very dark, and a nice happy story was very welcome. Four thumbs up! (Yeah, four, because anything can happen in fantasy)
« Last Edit: May 07, 2008, 11:26:06 AM by Russell Nash »

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Reply #17 on: May 04, 2008, 06:47:41 AM
If I ever meet Mike Resnick, I'm not sure whether I'll punch him in the face or shake his hand and thank him.  This was yet another in a long line of his stories that strongly resonated with me. I'm going to really have to start paying attention to what I've chosen to listen to while driving.

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cuddlebug

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Reply #18 on: May 04, 2008, 02:03:15 PM
What a wonderful story, and it brought me to tears as well, which was very embarassing as I was walking through town while I was listening.

Amongst many other things it made me realize … and I know this is a bit of a jump, …

but it made me see that Time Travel will not be possible (for a wider public at least) during my lifetime, because if it was, my 70 year old self would most certainly have come back in time to kick my butt and make me realize a few things. Oh, and of course she would be able to point me in the right direction, as far as finding THE SOULMATE goes or at least tell me how to make a relationship last, assuming she had actually figured that out by then, … which makes me even sadder now, because maybe she never has and does not see the point in coming back, because she would actually not have anything to teach me. Oh no!  :'(



wintermute

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Reply #19 on: May 04, 2008, 02:53:01 PM
First of all, the reading rates eleven out of ten. Best narration I can remember on EP.

I did love it. As others have said, the pacing was perfect, and the plot was simple and yet resonant. There was one point that was slightly jarring for me, and I'm still not sure if it's a valid criticism or not; and that's the Walters' love of Humphrey Bogart. It implies that Old Walter was a fan of the modern blockbusters, and young Walter is a fan of the old classics. I can't decide id this is a point of similarity or difference between them.

Anyway, I loved it, and would not be unhappy if this wins the Hugo.

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Reply #20 on: May 04, 2008, 06:35:46 PM
The high praise on the boards makes me wonder if I shouldn't listen to this one once more. I liked it well enough when I listened to it, but it didn't make me laugh, or cry, or fall down, or change my life. To me it was  a fairly cool idea told very well by the author and the reader, but it didn't really strike a chord.

Maybe if I listen to it with my wife instead of at the gym it will strike me differently.

Looking forward to more Hugo's!

I feel similar - and am now wondering if I'm a completely unfeeling bastard of a person since it seems like the story struck such a strong, emotionally resonant chord in others.

With that said, however, the story is interesting in a philosophical way if you really think through some of the implications. Specifically, I wonder about the place of free will in a universe where people are iterations of previous people. If two people are "destined" to be together - or rather, their happiness is conditional upon those two and only those two people getting together, is there personal agency? Also, the two Didi's obviously grew up in different time with different parents in different places . . . yet became nearly identical adults. Which indicates a world where everything we are is contained in . . . what? Our genes? Our souls? I've always thought that if soul-mates actually existed it would be a hugely existential joke played by the universe considering that the odds of actually meeting that one person on a planet of billions would be pretty low. Unless of course, soul-mates are always always born within a relatively small geographic area of each other and almost always born within the same socio-economic bracket.

Of course these thoughts might also simply be evidence that I'm a cold, cold man with no sense of romance. ;) And maybe I'm raising points that aren't meant to be raised, but since I wasn't as emotionally involved as others, I had to do something with my mind while listening.

I agree that Steve Anderson did a quite good job of reading the story, but I still find myself irked by most male narrators doing female voices. While they may indeed bring lots of characterization and individuality to the male characters, the female characters often have a cookie-cutter quality. I felt that, as good as Mr. Anderson was, his reading of Didi fell into that pattern. I think every male reader of fiction should listen to Neil Gaiman read his own work and study how he does his women characters. He manages to convey a great amount of characterization and variety without every falling into that let-me-just-raise-the-pitch-of-my-voice-in-exactly-the-same-way-for-every-woman-character trap that some narrators fall into.

My reservations and thoughts aside, congratulations are due to Mr. Resnick, as well as all the other Hugo nominees.

Why is this thus? What is the reason for this thusness? - Artemus Ward


cuddlebug

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Reply #21 on: May 04, 2008, 07:39:37 PM

With that said, however, the story is interesting in a philosophical way if you really think through some of the implications. Specifically, I wonder about the place of free will in a universe where people are iterations of previous people. If two people are "destined" to be together - or rather, their happiness is conditional upon those two and only those two people getting together, is there personal agency? Also, the two Didi's obviously grew up in different time with different parents in different places . . . yet became nearly identical adults. Which indicates a world where everything we are is contained in . . . what? Our genes? Our souls? I've always thought that if soul-mates actually existed it would be a hugely existential joke played by the universe considering that the odds of actually meeting that one person on a planet of billions would be pretty low. Unless of course, soul-mates are always always born within a relatively small geographic area of each other and almost always born within the same socio-economic bracket.


Absolutely agree, good point.

So why is it that in today’s society (some/many?) people tend to believe there is that one and only ONE person for them, maybe leading them to give up on relationships when something does not fit perfectly, thinking there is something better out there, rather than working on it. Is not the recent increase of singles in society who stay single until they are well approaching the middle of their life supposed to be due to the fact that they are unwilling to settle for something less than perfect, someone who is not the ‘soulmate’ and they rather stay alone (among other reasons obviously, lack of opportunity, etc.)?

The idea of that kind of soulmate exactly made this a fantasy story, for in contrast to the story’s definition of the word, soulmates  in a realistic sense can only mean ‘two people who are well suited for each other, who share interests/values/priorities in life and still remain two entities at the same time’. Or something like that….

The fact that Walter actually met Didi (who even wore the same kind of clothes as his wife, despite the fact that fashion must have changed in the last 50 years and she would actually be ostracized by her peers for it, …. imagine a 19 year old today wearing your grandmother’s clothes) and felt ‘destined’ to help her find her own Walter, sorry if this sounds a little cynical, but that is why this is a ‘fairy tale’.

But don't get me wrong, I do believe the idea of soulmates, but rather my definition not the supernatural one.  :)



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Reply #22 on: May 04, 2008, 08:25:23 PM
A couple of quibbles with your quibbles ;)  :

*In the story, the younger Didi is 31 (not 19); as a children's magazine illustrator, you might imagine that she would dress somewhat conservatively, and if she favors certain colors and styles, well... there are only a handful of ways you can really change the old "skirt/blouse/sweater" cominations.

*The whole soulmates thing doesn't have to be as deterministic or as granular as previously implied.  Since Mr. Resnick wisely refrains from showing us the mechanics behind how the whole thing works, we can take some liberties and make up a reasonable explanation ourselves, if you like.  Say, for example, that it isn't the genes that determine personality, but rather the Spirit that influences the genes.  So when a person is conceived, the zygote attracts one of these mysterious soul-mates, and that Personality begins "setting the preferences", if you will.  Genes can express any number of ways... maybe the Person inside them has something to do with fine-tuning those expressions?

*As for the colossal coincidences, well, there are a lot of forces out there we don't understand.  It could be a kind of "spiritual splashing" effect - stay with me - where the souls fly apart into droplets at death, but eventually come back down and reconstitute, like a puddle, in their new bodies, with their similar, but ever-changing souls.  Maybe there's a spiritual kind of "surface tension" in play that draws certain pairs together in a recurring pattern.

Not that you should take any of my suggestions all that seriously... I'm just saying that within the universe of the story, there are a lot of ways to look at things that would otherwise be unlikely.  Then again... you never know.  ;)

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qwints

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Reply #23 on: May 04, 2008, 08:28:50 PM
While it's fairly obvious that this story does not reflect reality, that doesn't change the beauty of an old man doing one last kind act for the analogue of his love. Sure the idea of soul mates as such is fantasy and this story would be really freaking creepy if it were more realistic, but in the world it creates the story is deeply touching.

The lamp flared and crackled . . .
And Nevyrazimov felt better.


cuddlebug

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Reply #24 on: May 04, 2008, 08:52:25 PM
Of course it was a very touching story and it did move me very much, but although the story itself does not reflect reality, people’s (including my) reaction to the story was very emotional implying that the idea of ‘soulmates’ presented in the story does indeed reflect reality and what we hope for and believe in.
   
And TAD, I am surprised to find you are such a romantic.  :o

Well good for you and if I remember your posts correctly you have found your ‘soulmate’ (?).  Must have been the surface tension, don’t know if I understand that correctly, but does it have something to do with ‘friction’:D






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Reply #25 on: May 04, 2008, 09:35:20 PM
I don't see how this story actually does say there's a single soulmate for everyone.  Just because a person is naturally, or even supernaturally, suited to make another happy, that does not by definition say that that person is the ONLY one who he or she could be happy with.



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Reply #26 on: May 04, 2008, 09:38:36 PM
So why is it that in today’s society (some/many?) people tend to believe there is that one and only ONE person for them, maybe leading them to give up on relationships when something does not fit perfectly, thinking there is something better out there, rather than working on it. Is not the recent increase of singles in society who stay single until they are well approaching the middle of their life supposed to be due to the fact that they are unwilling to settle for something less than perfect, someone who is not the ‘soulmate’ and they rather stay alone (among other reasons obviously, lack of opportunity, etc.)?

The idea of that kind of soulmate exactly made this a fantasy story, for in contrast to the story’s definition of the word, soulmates  in a realistic sense can only mean ‘two people who are well suited for each other, who share interests/values/priorities in life and still remain two entities at the same time’. Or something like that….

Similar thoughts came to me when Didi was talking about how she could never seem to find the kind of love she saw in romantic movies.  It's why I tend to hate romantic movies, love songs, and all the other popular media that condition the young (particularly young girls) to expect a situation that doesn't exist outside of fantasy.  When the reality comes up short, how can they feel anything but bitter disappointment and that somehow they have (or their partner has) failed?

I don't believe in "soulmates".  I find the notion that there's only one ideal partner for any given person, if it were actually so, rather depressing.

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Reply #27 on: May 04, 2008, 11:02:55 PM
I don't believe in "soulmates".  I find the notion that there's only one ideal partner for any given person, if it were actually so, rather depressing.
Statistically, your soulmate probably lives somewhere in China or southern Asia, making the chances of meeting them quite slim.

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Reply #28 on: May 05, 2008, 02:14:59 AM
I don't believe in "soulmates".  I find the notion that there's only one ideal partner for any given person, if it were actually so, rather depressing.
Statistically, your soulmate probably lives somewhere in China or southern Asia, making the chances of meeting them quite slim.

Well, if you're going to accept a supernatural premise like "everyone has only one person they could be happy with," you could equally easily accept the idea that the distribution is nonrandom and that you are likely to encounter yours...



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Reply #29 on: May 05, 2008, 02:15:37 AM

And TAD, I am surprised to find you are such a romantic.  :o

Well good for you and if I remember your posts correctly you have found your ‘soulmate’ (?).  Must have been the surface tension, don’t know if I understand that correctly, but does it have something to do with ‘friction’:D


*blushes*  Yup, I found her, and now she's stuck with me. ;D

I don't believe in "soulmates".  I find the notion that there's only one ideal partner for any given person, if it were actually so, rather depressing.
Statistically, your soulmate probably lives somewhere in China or southern Asia, making the chances of meeting them quite slim.

Ana Ng and I are getting old, but we still haven't walked in the glow of each other's majestic presence...

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Reply #30 on: May 05, 2008, 02:48:08 PM
The emotional content of Mike Resnick's stories reminds me of Isaac Asimov's writing.  He crafts his character's feelings so deftly, and they just click into the scenario so neatly.

Excellent!



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Reply #31 on: May 05, 2008, 03:37:13 PM
I thought quite a bit about the film "Dead Again" after listening to this story.  I have no problem with the idea of being reincarnated to find your soulmate.

I liked the story, but I have an issue with the sheer amount of adverbs-ending-in-ly that Resnick uses, especially when tagging dialogue.  Maybe it's just me, but those tend to jump out to me and not in a positive way.  Still, and maybe again it's just me, but I don't see a lot of stories with elderly protagonists these days.  Maybe they're just not "sexy" enough for people to want to write about them, for fear the stories won't appeal to enough people.  *shrug*

The reading was great.  I agree with the general sentiment reflected here:

I agree that Steve Anderson did a quite good job of reading the story, but I still find myself irked by most male narrators doing female voices. While they may indeed bring lots of characterization and individuality to the male characters, the female characters often have a cookie-cutter quality. I felt that, as good as Mr. Anderson was, his reading of Didi fell into that pattern. I think every male reader of fiction should listen to Neil Gaiman read his own work and study how he does his women characters. He manages to convey a great amount of characterization and variety without every falling into that let-me-just-raise-the-pitch-of-my-voice-in-exactly-the-same-way-for-every-woman-character trap that some narrators fall into.

However, I didn't think Anderson did too bad with Didi.

I loved the little teaser at the outro.

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Reply #32 on: May 05, 2008, 05:22:14 PM
I enjoyed this story. I can't say that it struck a particular resonance with me, but I thought it was a really cool story, and I really enjoyed Mike's "writer's commentary" that he threw in earlier. Knowing the song that inspired it made the story even more touching for me. Thanks, TAD, for the links to listen to it.

Unlike most others here, though, I didn't like the voice of the narrator—not for this particular tale. I can't remember now what I had intended to say I specifically disliked about the voice, but it just didn't work for me in this story. I think it was along the lines that it was too harsh for this piece. I hear this voice belonging to the Veteran in episode 118.



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Reply #33 on: May 06, 2008, 12:03:19 AM
I gotta say I'm surprised by the Asimov comparison - hasn't Asimov always been criticized for having fairly flat characters? I love his writing, but I never found his characters emotionally compelling in the way I found an author like Orson Scott Card's characters compelling.

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Reply #34 on: May 06, 2008, 12:11:12 AM
I gotta say I'm surprised by the Asimov comparison - hasn't Asimov always been criticized for having fairly flat characters? I love his writing, but I never found his characters emotionally compelling in the way I found an author like Orson Scott Card's characters compelling.

I agree.  When I finally got around to reading the Foundation series, I thought it was "all plot"; the characters were just there to move the story along.

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Reply #35 on: May 06, 2008, 03:56:19 AM
A couple of quibbles with your quibbles ;)  :
*cut*

*As for the colossal coincidences, well,
*cut*
my favorite quote on that is here Yogi Berra

as for the story my first reaction was " that is a Hugo nominee? dang the nominators must have been desperate" 
however after reading so many positive posts I am going to have to go back and re listen to it sometime soon when I am not doing HW on the side

* edit apparently I am having issues w/ links tonight*


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Reply #36 on: May 06, 2008, 04:38:58 AM
LOVED this one!  It had me smiling half-way through and chuckling to the end.

And it's an appropriate story for me as my wife and I approach 10 years married!

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Reply #37 on: May 06, 2008, 10:47:22 AM
  Still, and maybe again it's just me, but I don't see a lot of stories with elderly protagonists these days.  Maybe they're just not "sexy" enough for people to want to write about them, for fear the stories won't appeal to enough people.  *shrug*

I imagine it's more a matter of the number of readers that would be able to relate to the protagonist. An adult can remember what it was like to be a teenager, but a teenager doesn't have the life experience to fully relate to an adult protagonist. The number of people who have the experience to know what it's like to be a 70 year old man is naturally small, which reduces the effectiveness of the story on the readership as a whole. This doesn't mean that children shouldn't read stories about adults, or that adults shouldn't read about the elderly, just that there's a missing element in the experience.



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Reply #38 on: May 06, 2008, 12:36:42 PM
I was going to say that this story didn't do much for me. But after reading all the other comments, I'm afraid to. ;)



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Reply #39 on: May 06, 2008, 01:01:17 PM
I wasn't blown away by this one.  It was fairly engaging and had some nice moments but it didn't resonate with me the way it has with other listeners. 

I much preferred Mike Resnick's "the big guy".

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Reply #40 on: May 06, 2008, 07:20:05 PM

I imagine it's more a matter of the number of readers that would be able to relate to the protagonist. An adult can remember what it was like to be a teenager, but a teenager doesn't have the life experience to fully relate to an adult protagonist. The number of people who have the experience to know what it's like to be a 70 year old man is naturally small, which reduces the effectiveness of the story on the readership as a whole. This doesn't mean that children shouldn't read stories about adults, or that adults shouldn't read about the elderly, just that there's a missing element in the experience.

I think that having a close relationship with an elder can give you an idea of that kind of experience. For example, the narrator in this story reminded me of my grandfather and that's why the story affected me so strongly.

Reaction might also split based on who has a significant other who they see as a soulmate.

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Reply #41 on: May 06, 2008, 08:20:20 PM
My play-by-play of the story :

5 minutes in : That old guy sure is creepy.
10 minutes in ; Yup, still with the creepy.
20 minutes in : What is the point of this story?
31 minutes in : Oh, i get it, there Was no point.

Can anyone explain this story to me? There was maybe 5 minutes of actual content stretched into 30 minutes of endless repeat.

The reading was ok, it did a good job of emulating the way an old man would think,, but it was perhaps too good since it got annoying real fast, but maybe that is because the main character was completely unlikable.

I dont know much about the Hugo awards but if this is the kind of fluff that gets nominated i have a hard time taking it seriously.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2008, 08:28:36 PM by Rain »



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Reply #42 on: May 06, 2008, 09:15:00 PM
My play-by-play of the story :

5 minutes in : That old guy sure is creepy.
10 minutes in ; Yup, still with the creepy.
20 minutes in : What is the point of this story?
31 minutes in : Oh, i get it, there Was no point.

Can anyone explain this story to me? There was maybe 5 minutes of actual content stretched into 30 minutes of endless repeat.

The reading was ok, it did a good job of emulating the way an old man would think,, but it was perhaps too good since it got annoying real fast, but maybe that is because the main character was completely unlikable.

I dont know much about the Hugo awards but if this is the kind of fluff that gets nominated i have a hard time taking it seriously.

While hardly my favourite EP, I feel that I have to suggest that you listen again.

An old man just lost his wife of many decades, and then he randomly sees a young woman looks just like his wife at that age. Turns out the woman has the same name, job, dislikes and tastes as his wife had. He spends time with her. She breaks up with her boyfriend. He falls in love with her, but she doesn't fall in love with him. He finds out he's going to die. He randomly meets a young man who reminds him eerily of himself, who has just broken up with his girlfriend. He makes plans to introduce the young people to each other.

Why did you think the main character was unlikeable?



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Reply #43 on: May 06, 2008, 10:04:04 PM
While in general I liked this story better than most Resnick offerings, and I thought it had some great moments, and the reading was excellent, I have to ditto Rain on the creeptasticness of the protagonist.  Add to that a dose of smug ('I'll fix you up with this lovely girl, you HAVE to like her') and I found that the main character was pretty unlikeable myself.

However, I was still able to empathize with him, and I still liked the story.  Maybe it spoke to my inner creep or something.  I like that Resnick chose to portray an older man, with all the frailties and foibles that are available to such a character. I'd like to hear and read more stories with old people in them, quite frankly.  I'm a little tired of stories where everyone is between 18-25, given that I find people of that age boring most of the time (sorry, ageist, I know!  I believe your boring 20 year old self should have the same rights and privileges and make wages commensurate with your skill regardless of experience, if that makes you feel better). 

Anyway, score one for Resnick, though like Rain, I find this story peculiarly mushy to be a Hugo offering.  I had the Edward Bear sentimentality issue with it, though not nearly as bad as with Edward Bear.  The Benadryl remained safe in the cabinet throughout this episode of the podcast, and I only sneezed twice.  I'm kind of boggled by the sentimentality streak that I've been shown SF geeks have through the EP forums, and I'm still thinking about that and trying to work out what it might mean.  (By contrast, Tideline appeals to sentiment without being sentimental, IMO, not that I'm voting for the Hugos or anything). 

Also, thanks for providing the story background, mike-resnick, I find that stuff fascinating.

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Reply #44 on: May 06, 2008, 10:20:25 PM
I can easily see how this story can be viewed as overly mushy - I think the main reason I didn't view it as that myself is that it's been pretty long since I last read/heard something as explicitly sentimental. It's something I can enjoy every once in a while, but not if I'm exposed to it too often.

But I'm surprised at people finding the protagonist creepy. I just don't see that. I can see why his initial behavior can give a somewhat odd impression, but I think it's negated pretty quickly. Definitely not still there at 10 minutes in. I'm wondering if Rain or Anarkey would elaborate on that a bit - what is it about him or his behavior that makes him creepy?

I do agree on the smug note of the ending, by the way, but I excused it on the fact that it was the ending. If the story had continued one more sentence, then the current last sentence would have been intolerable.



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Reply #45 on: May 06, 2008, 11:30:35 PM
But I'm surprised at people finding the protagonist creepy. I just don't see that. I can see why his initial behavior can give a somewhat odd impression, but I think it's negated pretty quickly. Definitely not still there at 10 minutes in. I'm wondering if Rain or Anarkey would elaborate on that a bit - what is it about him or his behavior that makes him creepy?

Rain will have to do her own elaborating, but for my part, there's a lot of stalkerly behavior justified in internal monologue by 'I can't be a stalker because I can't get it up'.  No.  Dude.  Your ability to fulfill the sexual act is independent of behaving like a stalker.  And engaging in a lot of convincing yourself as to how you're not a stalker is probably a solid signal that you're behaving like a stalker.  Also, the tests he keeps devising by inviting her to stuff his Deirdre hated or mentioning things he knows she won't like?  Ugh.  How much of that is justified before one is just being a jackass?  There are more instances than the narrative rule of three generally calls for, so I can only deduce he enjoys running young Deirdre through the gamut of emotion, and that it's a point about his character that he keeps testing her.  She also pretty clearly gives off 'leave me alone' signals (verbally and physically) at the beginning which he ignores, though she does seem to be persuaded by the weirdness of it all to tolerate him, and they do seem to move on to a genuine friendship at some point.  Still, after their friendship is well-established he continues to use her company for wish fulfillment (and is cognizant of it), and yet isn't at all perturbed by his use of her in this way.  It has some interesting parallels, now that I give it some thought, to the clone story, where the girl made another version of herself to get away from creepy controlling insecure guy.  In this case, had the protag not been given a death sentence, he might have continued to use Deirdre as his surrogate lover indefinitely.  It's only because he is about to check out that he works to give her a chance at her own happiness.  IOW, he doesn't become an altruist until he doesn't need her anymore (though I'll admit there's other plot elements, such as the boyfriend breakup which apply at that point).  Still, it's enough to justify a sense of creepiness for me, that's for sure.

Again, I liked the story.  But I can totally see the creepy and felt it myself, to some degree.

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Reply #46 on: May 07, 2008, 12:15:18 AM
There are so few things that give meaning to life. This story reminded me that my future wife is one of them. I listened while walking around the mall, and I noticed a lot of older couples holding hands and laughing everywhere. I suppose that that kind of connection goes on since the beginning of time, and it will go on and on... The reader was amazing!



qwints

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Reply #47 on: May 07, 2008, 01:34:18 AM
On the creepiness thing:

If the story hadn't been in the context of magical realism (e.g. if it had been on Pseduopod) he would have been really creepy. I don't think that the continued testing is any way cruel. Is it really that traumatizing to be asked to go to a movie you don't like?

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Reply #48 on: May 07, 2008, 03:41:33 AM
On the creepiness thing:

If the story hadn't been in the context of magical realism (e.g. if it had been on Pseduopod) he would have been really creepy. I don't think that the continued testing is any way cruel. Is it really that traumatizing to be asked to go to a movie you don't like?

Depends.  If you ask my wife to go see Cloverfield again, I'd say yes :)


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Reply #49 on: May 07, 2008, 03:59:15 AM
I know I'm probably the only one who thinks this but I really don't like Steve Anderson's readings.  I know this is subjective, but every story I hear him read I feel the same way.  Every sentence...is groaned out...and has a big...emphasis...on everything.   From the start... to finish... he uses the same inflection...on everything.
C'mon.
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Reply #50 on: May 07, 2008, 04:14:53 AM
I know I'm probably the only one who thinks this but I really don't like Steve Anderson's readings.  I know this is subjective, but every story I hear him read I feel the same way.  Every sentence...is groaned out...and has a big...emphasis...on everything.   From the start... to finish... he uses the same inflection...on everything.
C'mon.
"Trying too hard" sums it up for me.  In audiofiction, story is 1/3 and story telling is 2/3.
You aren't the only one. I thought his voice would have been good for this week's PC Hotel Astarte, but not this particular story.



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Reply #51 on: May 07, 2008, 04:22:44 AM
On this one, I guess I'm just another member of the camp that found it OK, but not overwhelming.  

I didn't find the narrator's behavior creepy, since we knew why he was doing it, though I was surprised that the woman agreed to have dinner with him on a regular basis.  It makes sense to me that having identified some sort of larger (and apparently benign) force at work, trying to understand how to cooperate with it an play the right role is the right thing to do.  

As for the "soulmate" thing, the problem that I see with it is that it gives too much emphasis to who comes into the relationship, and not enough on what they put into it.  Love, to my mind, is mostly a matter of doing what is right for the relationship, and putting the needs of the relationship first. (Note that sometimes, the right thing is to take care of yourself.) I'll grant that this seems easier with the "right" person, but getting it done is more important than your reason for doing so.

I thought the narrator was a great pick for this story, too...

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Reply #52 on: May 07, 2008, 11:07:41 AM
Rain will have to do her own elaborating, but for my part, there's a lot of stalkerly behavior justified in internal monologue by 'I can't be a stalker because I can't get it up'.  No.  Dude.  Your ability to fulfill the sexual act is independent of behaving like a stalker. 

... She also pretty clearly gives off 'leave me alone' signals (verbally and physically) at the beginning which he ignores, though she does seem to be persuaded by the weirdness of it all to tolerate him, and they do seem to move on to a genuine friendship at some point. 

... Still, it's enough to justify a sense of creepiness for me, that's for sure.

Again, I liked the story.  But I can totally see the creepy and felt it myself, to some degree.

Alright, let me preface these remarks by saying that I have a great deal of respect for Mr. Resnick; I don't intend anything here to disparage his skills or track record as a writer.  If I ever manage to get published, I hope to maintain the grounded sense of dignity and good sportsmanship that he has shown by wading in with the opinionated masses here in the forums on occasion.

However, part of my defense of Old Walter lies in a writerly flaw; I don't think the patterns of creepiness that Anarkey picked up on (and I assume the same is true for Rain to some extent) came from Mike Resnick trying to convince his audience that Walter is not a stalker, rather than from Walter trying to convince himself that his motives are ... less unpure.  To his credit, the line was less crude than "I can't get it up, so I can't be a stalker"; it was phrased in a way that seemed more like an aside, and I thought it was meant to dispel any audience associations with Lolita.  I think it was a mistake on the part of the author, because a) at 31, Didi is no Lolita, and b) it put the sex angle into the mind of the reader - which made it sound creepier (as evidenced by Anarkey's comments) than intended.

The other part of my defense, though, should compliment Mr. Resnick's sensibilities.  I think it's quite uncharitable to call Walter's behavior creepy and compare him to a stalker.  He's lonely, for one thing; that should be obvious.  He's also confronted with the person he is missing most - not just a close resemblance, but the *real* thing, right down to the perfume. 

If you've spent any time around the elderly you notice two things: they are very intensely interested in you once you get their attention (which can be confused with "unwelcome attention") and their more distant memories are far more real and relevant than anything happening in their present.  You can see both traits at play in this story.

And I wonder, if it had been Didi who had survived (since statistically, women tend to outlive their men) would you have had the same qualms about her finding her young Walter?  Would you be bothered by her behavior?  I'm sure that if Mr. Resnick had written the story with an elderly female protagonist, the idea that she was looking to bed the younger version of her dead spouse would not have even been raised.

I may not have convinced you that Walter is less creepy... but I hope I've made you reconsider how you judge real old-timers!  (Because I've been feeling like one of them since that last birthday.  :P )


As for the "soulmate" thing, the problem that I see with it is that it gives too much emphasis to who comes into the relationship, and not enough on what they put into it.  Love, to my mind, is mostly a matter of doing what is right for the relationship, and putting the needs of the relationship first. (Note that sometimes, the right thing is to take care of yourself.) I'll grant that this seems easier with the "right" person, but getting it done is more important than your reason for doing so.


Absolutely!  That attitude has a lot to do with "not being sure", too.  If you're too busy looking for "that exciting feeling", you will probably miss the stable, loving relationship that you claim you want.

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Reply #53 on: May 07, 2008, 11:57:40 AM
my favorite quote on that is here Yogi Berra

Stepping in here as a moderator.  When you're referring to a seven word quote, just put in the quote instead of linking to a page where the quote is down the page.  It just makes things a little easier.



Biscuit

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Reply #54 on: May 07, 2008, 09:42:17 PM
Sometimes I feel we over-analyse. Discourse is great, but sometimes a simple love story is a simple love story.

While some may disparage the sentimentality of a Simple Love Story, or find less than savoury meanings that weren't intended (is that a generation thing? Has the media primed us to find a creep in every seeming good deed?), Mike Resnick makes it flow so effortlessly, makes the emotion effective without being cheesey, that the simplicity should be applauded.

In an age where some writers seem to be throwing out a "Beat THIS!" with their technical wankery, it's refreshing to have someone write WELL about the simple things in life. As I've said before I'm not a big fan of over-sentimental SF&F, but I am always impressed by someone who can write it without making it glurg.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2008, 09:45:58 PM by Biscuit »



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Reply #55 on: May 07, 2008, 10:01:01 PM
(is that a generation thing? Has the media primed us to find a creep in every seeming good deed

You know, I didn't really have time today to respond to Anarkey properly, and I was sort of hoping Rain would post as well, but I agree with this worry, as well as with what TAD posted. It seems to me, especially after reading Anarkey's post, that to interpret the man's actions as creepy we need to be subconciously primed for an excuse to do so - it is a reflection of a society where basic human interaction is discouraged outside of very narrowly prescribed social bounderies, where an old man taking any type of interest in a younger woman, for whatever reason, is viewed with suspicion and possible disgust. Where any overture which is not immediately welcomed is viewed as unwelcome attention. Where openness is interpreted as either vulnerability or creepiness, depending on who exhibits it.

Not, mind you, that I'm saying that that is Anarkey's attitude, or Rain's attitude. What I'm saying is that that is the underlying current in our society, and that it affects all our attitudes to some degree.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2008, 10:29:46 PM by eytanz »



qwints

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Reply #56 on: May 08, 2008, 04:48:47 AM
Just to play devil's advocate, there are real reasons for being creeped out by the protagonist. A feminist reading of the passage could focus on the woman's unhealthy need to find her identity as a wife and the old man as the voice of the patriarchy forcing her into an eternity of subjugation. I don't think that would be a proper reading of the story and an actual literary critic would be much more subtle.
With that kind of critique in mind, this quote made me think.
Quote from: eytanz link=topic=1577.msg26257#msg26257
date=1210197661
It seems to me, especially after reading Anarkey's post, that to interpret the man's actions as creepy we need to be subconciously primed for an excuse to do so - it is a reflection of a society where basic human interaction is discouraged outside of very narrowly prescribed social bounderies, where an old man taking any type of interest in a younger woman, for whatever reason, is viewed with suspicion and possible disgust. Where any overture which is not immediately welcomed is viewed as unwelcome attention. Where openness is interpreted as either vulnerability or creepiness, depending on who exhibits it.

Not, mind you, that I'm saying that that is Anarkey's attitude, or Rain's attitude. What I'm saying is that that is the underlying current in our society, and that it affects all our attitudes to some degree.
Although Mr. Resnick's comments early in the thread make me discard this as intentional, there is an element in this story which could be an argument that social taboos constantly restrict us from our true happiness. Think of all the people you come in contact with in a modern society who you never even acknowledge the existence of. The idea that your soulmate could be a local stranger is a powerful one. Given the restrictions we place on our interactions with strangers for well founded reasons,  I could run into a best friend or a soul mate regularly without a prayer of ever getting to know them.

As I think about it, young Dede's passivity does start to bother me. The internal conflict she has between the fear of being alone and the fear of ending up with the wrong person is a very believable one, but the only thing we see her do is fret over her dilemma. I guess I need to see the protagonist as a fairy godmother type figure who steps into to save the day. I can't help liking the story, but the more I think about it, the more powerful I think a good feminist critique of it would be.

*edited for a formatting error
« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 04:54:38 AM by qwints »

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cuddlebug

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Reply #57 on: May 08, 2008, 09:24:48 AM
(is that a generation thing? Has the media primed us to find a creep in every seeming good deed

It seems to me, especially after reading Anarkey's post, that to interpret the man's actions as creepy we need to be subconciously primed for an excuse to do so - it is a reflection of a society where basic human interaction is discouraged outside of very narrowly prescribed social bounderies, where an old man taking any type of interest in a younger woman, for whatever reason, is viewed with suspicion and possible disgust. Where any overture which is not immediately welcomed is viewed as unwelcome attention.

... or in extreme cases HARASSMENT.

Where openness is interpreted as either vulnerability or creepiness, depending on who exhibits it.

I heard someone say something on this issue once which kind of stuck with me. He said "Flirting is only considered flirting as long as it is welcome, when it's not welcome it becomes harassment."

To my mind, the interesting thing in this story is, how the interpretation of Walter's behavior changes from being considered creepy or stalker..ly (?) to the behavior of a concerned friend who is doing one last good deed for his wife's Doppelgänger/reincarnation.

I have to say, I personally did not find his actions creepy at all, what did bother me though, was that he had to keep defending his behavior, by reassuring her, that he had no ulterior motives and does not intend to bed her. So going along with what has been said before, it seems like we are living in a society where our behavior has to be guarded at all times for fear of harassing others.... even if this means we are not actually doing and saying the things we might want to. Kind of sad, isn't it?



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Reply #58 on: May 08, 2008, 10:24:40 AM
Where openness is interpreted as either vulnerability or creepiness, depending on who exhibits it.

I heard someone say something on this issue once which kind of stuck with me. He said "Flirting is only considered flirting as long as it is welcome, when it's not welcome it becomes harassment."


I'm not entirely sure if you are agreeing with me or disagreeing with me. In any case, I should point out that continuing to flirt with someone AFTER they make it known that it is unwelcome is harassment. What I was railing against is the fact that we seem to have shifted to a society where you are prejudged - if you flirt with someone, or otherwise show attention, it is retroactively harassment unless the response is positive. I certainly think people need to respect other people's right to say "no", but I think "no" applies to the future - all else being kosher (i.e. the two parties involved are adults and there are no other special factors) it means "stop", not "you were wrong to try".



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Reply #59 on: May 08, 2008, 10:55:20 AM
Thanks for clearing that up. ... and yes, I was agreeing with you.



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Reply #60 on: May 08, 2008, 01:18:53 PM
my favorite quote on that is here Yogi Berra

Stepping in here as a moderator.  When you're referring to a seven word quote, just put in the quote instead of linking to a page where the quote is down the page.  It just makes things a little easier.
thanks for the tip

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Reply #61 on: May 09, 2008, 01:40:16 PM
An old man just lost his wife of many decades, and then he randomly sees a young woman looks just like his wife at that age.

I thought she had died a few years back.

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Darwinist

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Reply #62 on: May 09, 2008, 01:43:19 PM
An old man just lost his wife of many decades, and then he randomly sees a young woman looks just like his wife at that age.

I thought she had died a few years back.

They were married for decades.

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.    -  Carl Sagan


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Reply #63 on: May 09, 2008, 02:36:35 PM
An old man just lost his wife of many decades, and then he randomly sees a young woman looks just like his wife at that age.

I thought she had died a few years back.

They were married for decades.

But he hadn't "just" lost her.

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Reply #64 on: May 09, 2008, 03:56:11 PM
Wow. I'm shocked at the positive feedback to be honest. I thought this was a very mediocre story. My first reaction was "That got nominated for a Hugo?????".  Ignoring the fact that it isn't even science fiction, the story managed to combine trite sentimentality with a lack of narrative drive and a predictable ending. The second Walter got his death sentence from the Doc I knew where the story was headed.  I also just didn't like Walter that much - he's such an empty man. If your love for a woman consumes you to the point that you don't appear to have any real outside interests, hobbies or friends than that's a very unhealthy solipsistic  sort of love. It didn't help that the narration sounded like a younger person's imitation of a man in his 70s, not like a man in his 70s.

The really interesting angle of this story got missed in all Walter's self-pitying monologue - young Dierdre and Walter must really be sort of alienated outsiders in our era. While the original versions were very much people of their era, who are these early 30 year olds who apparently wear early 1960s fashions and whose aesthetic taste is trapped in the 50s? The "copies" seem like they are much more interesting than the "originals", yet we don't learn a lot about them.



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Reply #65 on: May 09, 2008, 06:38:23 PM

My first reaction was "That got nominated for a Hugo?????".




Not quite my first reaction, but it's the one that lingers.  It's a cute story, very skilfully told, occasionally moving, and paced nicely so as not to drag out the revelations that the reader has already guessed.  It may even be one of the best short stories of 2007 (not having read many new stories last year I wouldn't like to say).  But if that's the best Speculative Fiction of last year then I think the genre needs to take a long look at what makes its stories different from the rest of literature.



Quote

The really interesting angle of this story got missed in all Walter's self-pitying monologue - young Dierdre and Walter must really be sort of alienated outsiders in our era. While the original versions were very much people of their era, who are these early 30 year olds who apparently wear early 1960s fashions and whose aesthetic taste is trapped in the 50s?




That thought kept distracting me too.



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Reply #66 on: May 09, 2008, 06:40:59 PM

Quote

The really interesting angle of this story got missed in all Walter's self-pitying monologue - young Dierdre and Walter must really be sort of alienated outsiders in our era. While the original versions were very much people of their era, who are these early 30 year olds who apparently wear early 1960s fashions and whose aesthetic taste is trapped in the 50s?




That thought kept distracting me too.

I did think about that some, especially when young Walter called old Walter "Fella."


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Reply #67 on: May 09, 2008, 07:02:15 PM
The really interesting angle of this story got missed in all Walter's self-pitying monologue - young Dierdre and Walter must really be sort of alienated outsiders in our era. While the original versions were very much people of their era, who are these early 30 year olds who apparently wear early 1960s fashions and whose aesthetic taste is trapped in the 50s?

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« Last Edit: May 09, 2008, 07:03:53 PM by stePH »

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Reply #68 on: May 15, 2008, 09:31:05 AM
Good Lord that Mr. Anderson can read a story. Here's hoping he takes the blue pill so he can read again, eh?



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Reply #69 on: May 15, 2008, 11:41:37 AM
Wow, wonderful story. I really love Mike Resnick Stories. Barnaby in Exile was superb! I want more of those :]  Bring 'em on!!!

Also, great to hear from the master himself how he came to write this story. Gives the story even more depth IMHO.

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Reply #70 on: May 15, 2008, 02:24:48 PM
Fantastic story, excellent reading, A+!

I was engaged instantly, the story kept my complete attention until the last word, and gave me plenty to think about afterwards. Three cheers for Escape Pod!



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Reply #71 on: May 18, 2008, 08:56:14 AM
While the narration was excellent and I can see that there is a good story there, it just did not spark any interest in me.
So I think it was down to my own tastes rather than being a poor story that I found it boring.


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Reply #72 on: May 29, 2008, 03:01:44 PM
Sadly, I have to agree with those who dislike the story. All the time while listening to this I hade the terrible vision how this story would spawn a movie directed by Norah Ephron, starring Kevin Costner and Gwyneth Paltrow. This actually makes me wonder how on earth stories get nominated for a Hugo ...
« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 03:03:35 PM by multikay »



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Reply #73 on: July 02, 2008, 06:20:20 PM
I thought it was okay and then I read the break down in here and decided it was claaaaaap!

I know I am a newb and totally behind on the stories... but if I may:

The old dude was totally creepy.  And YES, there is a fine line.  If the person is hot/cool it is a boyfriend/girlfriend, otherwise it is a stalker. =)

The chick was a total slut, just look at what she was wearing.  She was asking for it. 

Seriously, is it REALLY that hard to find somebody?  I guess if you believe in the whole "soul mate" thing.. well.  I think that is sad and incredibly limiting.  How many people do you know that are together that didn’t like the first impression of the other?  And perhaps I am alone, but who I "like" changes from moment to moment.  But most of the time a good fart joke is the ticket. 

I think this is just a story to make people that won’t settle for that special anyone to break out the tissues.

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Reply #74 on: July 11, 2008, 08:25:14 AM
(is that a generation thing? Has the media primed us to find a creep in every seeming good deed

You know, I didn't really have time today to respond to Anarkey properly, and I was sort of hoping Rain would post as well, but I agree with this worry, as well as with what TAD posted. It seems to me, especially after reading Anarkey's post, that to interpret the man's actions as creepy we need to be subconciously primed for an excuse to do so - it is a reflection of a society where basic human interaction is discouraged outside of very narrowly prescribed social bounderies, where an old man taking any type of interest in a younger woman, for whatever reason, is viewed with suspicion and possible disgust. Where any overture which is not immediately welcomed is viewed as unwelcome attention. Where openness is interpreted as either vulnerability or creepiness, depending on who exhibits it.

Not, mind you, that I'm saying that that is Anarkey's attitude, or Rain's attitude. What I'm saying is that that is the underlying current in our society, and that it affects all our attitudes to some degree.
That it does.

I'm a guy, 55 years old, and pretty much look it. About a year and a half ago, I was driving to work as usual on a back road that cuts off a few hundred meters from my route, and is generally less populated and more scenic (farm, cow pasture, hayfields, etc.) than the main road. I see this girl jogging. I recognise her as the fairly attractive teenage daughter, Melanie, of my wife's good friend Donna. We had met her at odd times when we visited Donna. Melanie was on the high school soccer team, and I figured the running was part of her training. I give a brief wave as I pass her. Then it seemed that every morning I would pass her at about the same place, like clockwork. She'd give this shy little wave as I passed, and I'd wave back. Last spring, she didn't show up for a few months, and I knew that Melanie had graduated and would be going to university about 200 km away. I figured she went early, for a summer job or something. Then one day in the early fall, I saw her running again - same time, same general area. We waved.

A few days later I was talking to Donna on the phone and asked her if Melanie had been home for the weekend. Donna said "no, why?" I explained about us waving to each other while I was driving to work on that back road. It turns out that the young woman I had been waving to was somebody else entirely. A total stranger, except for our waving ritual. I've never seen her in other places, such as the local grocery store, or at least I've never recognized her anywhere else.

Now I'm left with this conundrum. I have this vague need to explain myself or or apologize or something to this stranger, since the ritual began as a result of a misunderstanding on my part. Do I...
A. Stop waving back and ignore her from now on. (seems rude)
B. Keep waving as usual. (seems ... I dunno what)
C. Stop the car when I see her (on the deserted back road), roll down the window as she passes and start talking to her, to explain myself. (prepare to be pepper-sprayed?)

I've been primed to be aware that "option C." could make me seem creepy, especially if she decided to just keep running without hearing what I said. I wouldn't be able to try it again without scaring her. She might feel a need to change her route.
Maybe I could prepare a note and toss it out just before we pass each other, hoping that she'd pick it up and read after I drove by, but that just seems too weird, even to me.

The only thing I can figure might work is to find some other woman who also runs (hey, I know one who trains for marathons!) and who might know who the mystery runner is (it's a small town). I explain the situation to her, and she tells the mystery woman what's going on, and we merely continue with option B.

It all makes me feel like I'm in an episode of Seinfield.

I feed The Pod.
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Reply #75 on: July 11, 2008, 10:39:30 AM
I'm a guy, 55 years old, and pretty much look it. About a year and a half ago, I was driving to work as usual on a back road that cuts off a few hundred meters from my route, and is generally less populated and more scenic (farm, cow pasture, hayfields, etc.) than the main road. I see this girl jogging. I recognise her as the fairly attractive teenage daughter, Melanie, of my wife's good friend Donna. We had met her at odd times when we visited Donna. Melanie was on the high school soccer team, and I figured the running was part of her training. I give a brief wave as I pass her. Then it seemed that every morning I would pass her at about the same place, like clockwork. She'd give this shy little wave as I passed, and I'd wave back. Last spring, she didn't show up for a few months, and I knew that Melanie had graduated and would be going to university about 200 km away. I figured she went early, for a summer job or something. Then one day in the early fall, I saw her running again - same time, same general area. We waved.

A few days later I was talking to Donna on the phone and asked her if Melanie had been home for the weekend. Donna said "no, why?" I explained about us waving to each other while I was driving to work on that back road. It turns out that the young woman I had been waving to was somebody else entirely. A total stranger, except for our waving ritual. I've never seen her in other places, such as the local grocery store, or at least I've never recognized her anywhere else.

Now I'm left with this conundrum. I have this vague need to explain myself or or apologize or something to this stranger, since the ritual began as a result of a misunderstanding on my part. Do I...
A. Stop waving back and ignore her from now on. (seems rude)
B. Keep waving as usual. (seems ... I dunno what)
C. Stop the car when I see her (on the deserted back road), roll down the window as she passes and start talking to her, to explain myself. (prepare to be pepper-sprayed?)

I've been primed to be aware that "option C." could make me seem creepy, especially if she decided to just keep running without hearing what I said. I wouldn't be able to try it again without scaring her. She might feel a need to change her route.
Maybe I could prepare a note and toss it out just before we pass each other, hoping that she'd pick it up and read after I drove by, but that just seems too weird, even to me.

The only thing I can figure might work is to find some other woman who also runs (hey, I know one who trains for marathons!) and who might know who the mystery runner is (it's a small town). I explain the situation to her, and she tells the mystery woman what's going on, and we merely continue with option B.

It all makes me feel like I'm in an episode of Seinfield.

Planish,

That would be a funny as hell story written from both sides.  You'd need to talk to a few different women to get the runner's reaction/thinking right. 



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Reply #76 on: July 11, 2008, 01:34:59 PM

A. Stop waving back and ignore her from now on. (seems rude)
B. Keep waving as usual. (seems ... I dunno what)
C. Stop the car when I see her (on the deserted back road), roll down the window as she passes and start talking to her, to explain myself. (prepare to be pepper-sprayed?)

It all makes me feel like I'm in an episode of Seinfield.

I would go with "B" by process of elimination.  I guess I would err on the side of friendliness and keep waving rather than cutting her off or stopping the car and making a bigger deal out of it.  If you ever run in to her at the grocery store or gas station you can explain that she looks like someone else you know.  And I don't think it is all that weird, I run several times a week in the mornings and there are some other people out that I always meet but don't know and we always exchange a "Hi" or "Good Morning".  Good luck! 

For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.    -  Carl Sagan


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Reply #77 on: July 11, 2008, 09:56:35 PM
waving at strangers -> not bad

stopping to explain why you're waving -> potentially creepy



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Reply #78 on: July 12, 2008, 08:27:41 AM
That would be a funny as hell story written from both sides.  You'd need to talk to a few different women to get the runner's reaction/thinking right. 

Something like an O. Henry/Saki pastiche?

It could be difficult. I'd have to present her side in such a way that doesn't tip off the reader that she is not Melanie. Without the surprise element of me finally realising that she was someone else, I think it would be somewhat lame.

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Reply #79 on: August 20, 2010, 04:57:38 PM
This was one of those Hugo noms where I just didn't understand how it got nominated in the first place.  I think Resnick has been nominated pretty much every year for a good long time now, and when I like a story by him I REALLY like it.  But some years it seems like his story is nominated because a Resnick story is always nominated, not because they're any better than hundreds of other stories that year.

It was an okay love story.  Resnick's good at pulling out emotions, but this time the puppetmaster was just way too visible for me.  I could tell exactly where I was SUPPOSED to feel each reaction.  And because it was a Hugo nom, my expectations were higher.

It didn't make sense to me that the old and young versions dressed the same and liked the same movies.  All the hints were that they were essentially the same people in every meaningful way, but the context of the young man loving the old movies is very different from an old man loving old movies.  that didn't make any sense to me.

I usually love this readers voice, but in this story he could've dialed it down a few notches.  He's good at conveying emotions, but the emotions were laid on so thick this time that every word dripped with angst.  If there's no contrast between one part of the story and another then it conveys no change of emotion, and the constant thick emotion becomes distracting.  For me, it was so strong and so sustained that it went right past believable and into satirical exaggeration.  If he'd used that voice only at a select passage or two when he's feeling particularly strongly, then it could've been a real benefit to the reading. 



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Reply #80 on: August 24, 2010, 04:47:27 PM
This was one of those Hugo noms where I just didn't understand how it got nominated in the first place.  I think Resnick has been nominated pretty much every year for a good long time now, and when I like a story by him I REALLY like it.  But some years it seems like his story is nominated because a Resnick story is always nominated, not because they're any better than hundreds of other stories that year.

Susan Lucci syndrome.

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