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Author Topic: EP300: We go back  (Read 11976 times)
Brynn
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« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2011, 10:07:05 PM »

I couldn't really get into this one, but I think that's more a matter of my taste not gelling with the story more than anything else. I did enjoy Mur's reading, though.  Smiley
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Scatcatpdx
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« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2011, 11:33:23 PM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.
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Scattercat
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« Reply #22 on: July 12, 2011, 02:54:43 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.

You didn't know whether you were attracted to boys or girls when you were fourteen?
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Kaa
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« Reply #23 on: July 12, 2011, 09:31:33 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.

One of my friends knew at 7 that he was gay. It took him a few years to admit it. Each person is different.
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« Reply #24 on: July 12, 2011, 09:33:14 AM »

This story was reasonably good, but it definitely felt like a novel add-on.  All the stuff I most want to hear about was in the exposition lump, and left the rest somewhat lackluster in comparison.  I am glad that I can pick up the novel, which sounds very fun, but the story didn't stand very well on it's own to me.  The ending pun was really really bad, and made me groan, but not in a good way.  I was a little bit disappointed that her friend didn't become a supervillain.

Far from my favorite Pratt story, but still not at all bad.

I do wish we'd had a classic SF story for the landmark though, I kind of like looking forward to those and trying to guess what might be grabbed from the annals of history.  This just felt like any other episode.
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Kaa
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« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2011, 09:35:21 AM »

I could not possibly have loved this story more, even if it had come to my house and personally cleaned out the cat litter and alphabetized my DVD collection. It's stories like this one that lured me into science fiction (and fantasy and horror) in the first place.

Bravo, Tim Pratt. Brava, Mur Lafferty.

Bravisse.
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Lionman
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« Reply #26 on: July 12, 2011, 11:08:01 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.

You didn't know whether you were attracted to boys or girls when you were fourteen?

The idea was fine for the story, but I would tend to lean towards it being too early as well.  But, then again, that's been my experience, raised in SmallTown USA.  And it's also my bent that 14 year olds have different things to worry about at that age instead of who you're attracted too.  However, I pine for days gone by, I imagine. :-/

Like everyone else, I really liked how the story ended.  I was only slightly surprised by it, and very pleased with it.  However, it leads me to the next question: So, when do we get the sequel? :-)
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Sir Postsalot
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« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2011, 11:13:23 AM »

And it's also my bent that 14 year olds have different things to worry about at that age instead of who you're attracted too.  

From my memory of being 14, 14 year olds think about little else besides who they're attracted to.   Puberty's in full swing by that time.  If anything, I'd say it's a little early rather than a little too late.  Tongue
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jenfullmoon
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« Reply #28 on: July 12, 2011, 11:19:56 AM »

Giving up so much power for a friend who had just taken advantage of me, AND giving them the ring instead of just lending them help...  The teenager mind was one of the most alien I've ever run into on Escape Pod.

I think it's the reason and the circumstances as to why Jenny did it that made Randy change her mind. Jenny is essentially afraid for her LIFE here. She's facing imminent Christian re-education lockup for at least the next four years of her life, and her parents are seeing through all of her boy talk. The girl's terrified. Once you find out that Jenny's not doing this so much to scam someone so much as she needs to figure out how she's going to escape and take care of herself at age 14... well, I'd do what Randy did too.

I knew I was straight at the age of 5, by the way. I didn't even know what to DO with boys, but I knew that. It does start early.

I think it's entirely reasonable that Tim Pratt had a time-travel bracelet to be inspired by that comic...
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InfiniteMonkey
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« Reply #29 on: July 12, 2011, 11:35:16 AM »

I seem to be in the minority on this one. For me it was a solid "meh". Nothing much I really hated (but for one thing... don't worry, I'll get to that); certainly had no problem with the whole "lordy I'm queer and my parents will re-orient me!" motivation. Knew what I liked when I was 5, so 14's not too early in my book. And her parents aren't exactly evil. Just really closed-minded; though I see the desire to run.

But I found the gift of the ring to be a little much to swallow, as well as the protagonist's unwillingness to use the ring. I think it's the two together that sort of breaks the story for me. You can't make the case that this ridiculously generous gift is understandable from a teenage girl, but if that's the case, why was she so grown-up about not using the ring in the first place? And if she was grown about the perils of ring-use, then why hand it over to someone demonstrably even more reckless than she is? She has THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE to search through.. hell, multiverse - and she knew the territory. She could conceivably bring her back something just as useful but not as dangerous. A wand of mind control perhaps? "The cute girl I'm bringing home is really a cute boy, Mom and Dad... believe!"

However, the thing that really made me grit was the line about "but I'd help her bury the bodies"... I've simply heard that one times too many. I'm getting really tried of hearing repeated clever lines. I'm tired of repeated cleverness being a passport of Cool. Better to be clever on your own.  Of course, it all may be part of the whole "I'm a 14 year old girl" thing.

Not that I don't do it myself. As Jon Stewart says, "I'm old!"
« Last Edit: July 12, 2011, 12:02:13 PM by InfiniteMonkey » Logged
matweller
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« Reply #30 on: July 12, 2011, 11:45:54 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.
You DO realize that 12-year-old pregnancies are pretty common these days, right? Are all of those preggo tweens not sure which gender attracts them? It's not like it's something to be decided anyway, it's just a fact of their genetic programming present from birth just like it is for every other species of animal on Earth.

I'm a little annoyed that people feel sexuality even has to be discussed since, in the terms of this story, it's only a device not some flagrant, out-of-place soapbox speech.

All that aside, I thought this story was gloriously fun and interesting and well-written and has me totally interested in finding the related tales. Mission accomplished, Mr. Pratt.
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Biscuit
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« Reply #31 on: July 12, 2011, 06:22:23 PM »

It's fantastic that people are discovering their sexuality and who they are at a younger age, and that this gets reflected in YA. "Bored" with lesbian subtexts in YA? Gee, I wish some queer people could be quite so blase about representations of themselves in stories. I forgot where I read it recently, but the quote was along the lines of "if queer people were represented in fiction and media along the lines of our percentage of the population, it would be WAY more than it is now".

While it's still difficult to negotiate the roadblocks our society puts up, if young people have LESS crap to climb over than previous generations in regards to their sexuality, the better. And if that means not hushing up about queer issues when their young (won't someone think of the children!), cool.

I loved how this story flowed.
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Salul
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« Reply #32 on: July 12, 2011, 06:57:31 PM »

On any other episode number, not number 300...

I'm afraid I'm with acpracth and InfiniteMonkey on this one.
Certainly Tim Pratt is a talented author (although I confess I am not really so very into him, certainly not as much as many other listeners here seem to be); and the story flowed well enough. But it just wasn't gripping.
Not in the way EP 100 and 200 were.
And not in the way I was hoping EP 300 might be.
I realise the above is really not germane to the story per se, and might just come across as gripe.
I feel most of those who have raised issues with the story per se reflect aspects of what I thought; the exception being the sexuality of the MC. It didn't get in my way one bit.

If I were to nitpick, one particularity that annoyed me was that bracelet at the end: as with the ring, its use and its rather strange marginalization by the MC, the almost consequential 'invention' of a time-travel bracelet threatens with taking the awe out of these artefacts. Hence attempting to focus our attention on...what, precisely? not the MC and her friend, whose interaction isn't really gripping. Anyway, like I said, that's just picking a nit, no more.
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« Reply #33 on: July 12, 2011, 11:16:25 PM »

So while I was at the book store today, I asked about purchasing The Nex.  Frustratingly, they couldn't find anything for it.  So I came home tonight and investigated it at timpratt.org.  Another "boot to the head" moment occurred when I learned (or was reminded) that The Nex is one of the novels that Tim has serialized for free online (though I am sure he would still take a donation).  So anyway, anyone who is interested in reading The Nex can do so here.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2011, 11:19:32 PM by Swamp » Logged

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Scatcatpdx
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« Reply #34 on: July 13, 2011, 01:16:56 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.

You didn't know whether you were attracted to boys or girls when you were fourteen?
nope growing up in the 1960's and early 1970's I was nether pressured one way or another. In addition could the problem is we are pushing sexuality on kids way to early for ulterior motives, Ohhow great we boomers are, we just can mess up our own generation.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2011, 01:25:14 AM by Scatcatpdx » Logged
gifo
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« Reply #35 on: July 13, 2011, 04:21:53 AM »

On any other episode number, not number 300...

I'm afraid I'm with acpracth and InfiniteMonkey on this one.

Me three.

I'm calling shaggy dog on this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaggy_dog_story#Pun).  The moment the "we go back" pun was uncovered, the whole story fell into place as a build-up to it.

I agree with most of the positive feedback on characters, world building etc., but no way is this a X00 milestone story.
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stePH
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« Reply #36 on: July 13, 2011, 08:35:33 AM »

I agree with most of the positive feedback on characters, world building etc., but no way is this a X00 milestone story.

x00 is an arbitrary "milestone" anyway. Nothing to me. If this is your main criticism against the story, it's kind of petty (not just gifo, but everybody complaining that this story isn't "good enough" for ep. 300)
« Last Edit: July 13, 2011, 08:38:41 AM by stePH » Logged

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acpracht
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« Reply #37 on: July 13, 2011, 08:54:17 AM »

I agree with most of the positive feedback on characters, world building etc., but no way is this a X00 milestone story.

x00 is an arbitrary "milestone" anyway. Nothing to me. If this is your main criticism against the story, it's kind of petty (not just gifo, but everybody complaining that this story isn't "good enough" for ep. 300)
It's not a criticism against the story (please don't take it as such), but against editorial choice. It is not a criticism of the story, just its placement. An X00 story would be arbitrary, yes, except that precedent on Escape Pod hasn't established it as such. The decision has been made to make each of these something "special." If truly arbitrary, why even have Mur bring it up as a milestone and their reason for selecting "We Go Back" ?
Editorial choice and placement is an important factor in putting out any sort of entertainment. You don't put letters to the editor on the front page story of a magazine, do you? No, you lead with your strongest, most appealing story. Think of the X00 stories not only as front page but "Special Edition!" As such, it is not a petty criticism of the venue (not of the individual story).
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« Reply #38 on: July 13, 2011, 09:12:55 AM »

OK the story was well done but the whole motivation of Jenny's friend and the coming out, at a way too young age, angle left a bad taste.

You didn't know whether you were attracted to boys or girls when you were fourteen?
nope growing up in the 1960's and early 1970's I was nether pressured one way or another. In addition could the problem is we are pushing sexuality on kids way to early for ulterior motives, Ohhow great we boomers are, we just can mess up our own generation.

I guess I don't really understand what you're saying here.  Perhaps because I'm a child of the 80's?  I don't know of any pressure exerted on me to choose a sexual orientation, but I had crushes LONG before I was 14.  I mean, that's pretty well into the swing of puberty when all the hormones have gone completely haywire.  Granted, these crushes are not something I ever really acted on at that age, nor talked to adults about, but I knew damned well my sexual orientation long before that, and I don't think it had anything to do with societal pressure.


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Sir Postsalot
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« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2011, 09:22:29 AM »

I agree with most of the positive feedback on characters, world building etc., but no way is this a X00 milestone story.

x00 is an arbitrary "milestone" anyway. Nothing to me. If this is your main criticism against the story, it's kind of petty (not just gifo, but everybody complaining that this story isn't "good enough" for ep. 300)

Arbitrary, sure.  But no more arbitrary than the US drinking age being 21 revolutions around the sun or teatime being 4pm.

It's not that the story isn't "good enough" for ep 300, but that the round numbers are a good excuse to roll out some classic fiction.  Good does not imply classic, and classic does not imply good.  But it's a good excuse to have a different flavor for an arbitrary landmark, to mix things up.  I was hoping there would be something of an older variety just for this week, like an H.G. Wells or a Heinlein or something.
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