Author Topic: Pseudopod 245: Blue Eyes  (Read 12975 times)

Bdoomed

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on: September 03, 2011, 07:33:05 AM
Pseudopod 245: Blue Eyes

By Jay Caselberg
Jay is a member of the Book View Cafe, an online collective of writers publishing many titles in electronic form. Check ‘em out!

Read by Jen Williams, click her name to visit Senny Dreadful!

The man with the dog collar came the other night, standing sweating at the door, thin black hair plastered across his head. Me Mam has dog collars, but he brought his own. He always does. It was too late to go out, not that me Mam would’ve minded, but the streets aren’t safe when it’s dark near our place. So I had to watch.

Me Da wasn’t home. He never is. Or when he is, they fight, the stink of the booze hanging heavy in our two-roomed house.

He stayed for maybe an hour, the man with the dog collar. I watched as he sweated and strained, me Mam’s spiked heel pressed hard against his back, the black leather around his neck cinched tight, stained blacker where the sweat runnelled down from the back of his greasy head. Me Mam caught me looking once or twice and waved my looks away. So I watched the wall instead, pretending to read the old newsprint behind the places where the wallpaper peeled. I asked her once why she did it, but she called me a brat and a stupid little bitch and told me to shut up.

“How else we going to live?” she said.




Listen to this week's Pseudopod.

I'd like to hear my options, so I could weigh them, what do you say?
Five pounds?  Six pounds? Seven pounds?


Scattercat

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Reply #1 on: September 05, 2011, 10:53:57 AM
Is anyone else a little squicked that the story was about real events?  I was a little disconcerted by that; I don't much enjoy 'real crime' type stuff because much of the pleasure of a well-built narrative is sapped by the knowledge of the real-world nature of the incidents.  I don't like the idea of real people suffering.  That makes some of the more prurient details of the story seem... really icky.  I'd thought it was mildly entertaining when I heard it, but now I'm actively repelled by it.  And not the good kind of icky and creepy, either.

It's probably just me.  But ew.



kibitzer

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Reply #2 on: September 05, 2011, 12:42:47 PM
"a little squicked"?? I was chilled to the bone by this one, and that was before I knew it was based on real events.


Scattercat

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Reply #3 on: September 05, 2011, 01:53:46 PM
But to me, the reality of the story turns it from "Ooh, I'm creeped out, this is fun," to "Oh, ew.  I just enjoyed listening to a story in which actual people suffered and died."  It's like that image macro of a guy's hands holding a fortune cookie over an empty plate, and the fortune reads, "That wasn't chicken."  I'm iffy on using real people in stories - it has to be done either completely goofy (like Bill Murray in "Zombieland") or very truthfully to alleviate my concerns, and in general the more of a "celebrity" the person involved is, the less uncomfortable I am with it.  Here, we have a very private, very personal set of events that was just used to titillate me.  I'm okay with being pleasantly unnerved by a story about a preteen murderess when I know it is fictional (though I do prefer it when an author does more than just go, "Hey, isn't this creepy?")  When it's a story about actual events... I don't care to have them told to me in such a way as to evoke such an emotional reaction. 

FWIW, I have the same feeling and reaction to, for example, that appalling mess with the Casey Anthony trial (which you probably missed, kibitzer, being as you're on the other side of the world from it.  Basically, a mother killed her 2-year-old daughter either through neglect or through malice, and the trial was really popular as way to boost ratings for news shows.  Everyone had an opinion on it.  I turned off the TV in the employee break room rather than have to watch it.)  I'm not saying real events should never be retold or fictionalized in any way, but I do kind of resent springing it on me as a surprise at the end after presenting the story as pure fiction.  I'm much more willing to read/hear appalling and disturbing things used for artistic effect when I know they are created specifically for that purpose.  Using reality feels... disrespectful, a violation of privacy, especially with the rather grotesque sexual undertones and the emphasis on her inner thoughts that we saw in this story.



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Reply #4 on: September 06, 2011, 01:45:14 PM
I'm much more willing to read/hear appalling and disturbing things used for artistic effect when I know they are created specifically for that purpose.  Using reality feels... disrespectful, a violation of privacy, especially with the rather grotesque sexual undertones and the emphasis on her inner thoughts that we saw in this story.

My reaction was similar to this.  I'd rather this had been entirely fictional.  It bothers me when real events are taken and given POV that couldn't actually be documented and presented as fiction.  For me this usage was at least better than Ghosts of New York, because it at least didn't postulate a torturous afterlife for actual dead people.  It was chilling and well written on its own, but I was bothered when it was revealed to be true.  (And I think it's a little odd that there was a warning before the reveal that it was a news story, when the story itself contained the exact same events)

I'm assuming the title is from "Behind Blue Eyes" (by The Who I believe).  I love that song.



Thomas

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Reply #5 on: September 06, 2011, 03:04:13 PM
showing the darker side of the human condition. Criminal intent, Missing, Criminal Minds, Bones CSI are all tv shows the echo/mirror/replay the horrors of what humans do to each other.

Horror comes in many forms and one does not always need to look for it in fiction. whether it is a "fictionalized" or "dramatized" version of actual events or a work of pure fiction, doesn't matter, horror is horror, it takes many shapes and forms. the best is when it shows US in the mirror it holds up to us.

OH!
about the episode....
it totally creeped me out. When children playout the horrors they experience, nothing creepier..... and when it is based on actual events, OMG!

there is horror

there is reality

when the two coincide

RUN!

dear psuedopod,
do it again ....
« Last Edit: September 06, 2011, 06:32:23 PM by Thomas »

Enjoy and be nice to each other, because "WE" is all we got.


galacticus

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Reply #6 on: September 07, 2011, 06:30:08 PM
My thought process went from "Interesting, guess the 'horror' in all of this is that it could happen in real life" to learning the truth during the outtro to a half hour obsession with learning everything i could about the actual event.

To be honest, if it wasn't for the outtro, i wouldn't have given the story a second thought, it was the fact that it is inspired by a true event that made the story disturbing.

I'm curious as to whether or not the Author chose to only go so far with describing the events because of a respect for the actual victims? Then again, the author also implies that Mary is willing to kill again.

On another note, I was very surprised to learn that Mary Bell was granted a new identity and legal protections for the identity. I don't know if it's a UK or late 1960's thing, but here and now in the US, it seems like the person(s) who would do something like this, at whatever age, would be facing imprisonment for the rest of their lives, if not major hardship once they've served their time due to fact that most employers won't hire ex-cons and they would be in constant jeopardy from vigilante Psychopaths (A la Casey Anthony).
« Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 06:36:33 PM by galacticus »



ElectricPaladin

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Reply #7 on: September 07, 2011, 06:35:43 PM
Eh, mah, urk.

Awesome.

This story genuinely scared the sh*t out of me, and I greatly appreciate it. I haven't got anything else to say - brilliant story, brilliant reading, please ma'am may I have another?

Though, on the topic of "please ma'am" what's with the negative attitudes towards BDSM on the 'Pods these days? First Kill Me on Escape Pod, now mom the dominatrix in Blue Eyes - I'm beginning to think you guys have a complex. Can we get a story about a heroic top who saves his leather family from vampires, or something?

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eytanz

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Reply #8 on: September 07, 2011, 11:01:38 PM

Though, on the topic of "please ma'am" what's with the negative attitudes towards BDSM on the 'Pods these days? First Kill Me on Escape Pod, now mom the dominatrix in Blue Eyes - I'm beginning to think you guys have a complex. Can we get a story about a heroic top who saves his leather family from vampires, or something?


Feel like writing one?



ElectricPaladin

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Reply #9 on: September 07, 2011, 11:06:26 PM

Though, on the topic of "please ma'am" what's with the negative attitudes towards BDSM on the 'Pods these days? First Kill Me on Escape Pod, now mom the dominatrix in Blue Eyes - I'm beginning to think you guys have a complex. Can we get a story about a heroic top who saves his leather family from vampires, or something?


Feel like writing one?

You always say that. And then I do. Damnit, I'm busy this week!

I'll get back to you when I'm finished :P

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Sgarre1

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Reply #10 on: September 07, 2011, 11:38:50 PM
ELECTRICPALADIN - Trust me, we just publish the best of what we get submitted - I can barely pull-off keeping my side of things running, let alone coordinating with the other pods.

GALACTICUS (btw - I used to call Galactus "Galacticus" when I was a kid reading FF comics) - I don't remember the author implying that, myself, but could be forgetting something.  I honestly have no problem with someone who committed such acts as a child, considering the background that she had (Jay lets us off a little light here, as Bell has claimed her mother would occasionally "involve" her in the S&M scenarios with clients), being let out of jail as an adult after years of observation and, we assume, therapy.  But I understand why others might.

SCATTERCAT - I much prefer the fantastique in my horror as well, over the brutally realistic, but I am trying to offer a wide range of horror "variety" on Pseudopod to broaden tastes.  I agree with some of your comments but I'd debate that the story was just using these events to titillate the reader - sometimes horror isn't fun, sometimes it is deadly serious.  May not be your cuppa and all, but if Jay was setting out to titillate with violence, I assume he would have (for example) played up the (as it was, expertly elided while still implied) sexual mutilation of the second victim.

“The Civilized… murder their children by producing too many of them without being able to provide for their well-being. Morality or theories of false virtue stimulate them to manufacture cannon fodder, anthills of conscripts who are forced to sell themselves out of poverty. This improvident paternity is a false virtue, the selfishness of pleasure.”
Charles Fourier, “Elephant And Dog”


« Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 11:42:25 PM by Sgarre1 »



ElectricPaladin

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Reply #11 on: September 07, 2011, 11:56:07 PM
ELECTRICPALADIN - Trust me, we just publish the best of what we get submitted - I can barely pull-off keeping my side of things running, let alone coordinating with the other pods.

I'm sorry if my comment came off as genuine criticism; I really was just being flippant. You guys are awesome, and I have never suspected you of any editorial editorialization.

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Scattercat

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Reply #12 on: September 08, 2011, 02:03:35 AM
@Sgarre

It certainly wasn't torture porn, no, but I remain uncomfortable with the idea of writing the thoughts and motivations of a real person in this way.  I'm similarly uncomfortable with any kind of "true life story" stuff, though, other than autobiographies and authorized biographies.  It might have been better if Alasdair's explanation had come first and prepped me to listen to a "true story" instead of a story promised to be true via tagline.  ;-)



JayCaselberg

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Reply #13 on: September 08, 2011, 08:56:21 AM
Hey, all,

I am very interested  in this commentary to say the least.  I will continue to read with interest while I formulate some responses.

Best,
Caselberg



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Reply #14 on: September 08, 2011, 02:27:12 PM
I am very interested  in this commentary to say the least.  I will continue to read with interest while I formulate some responses.

I just thought I'd let you, Mr. Caselberg, know that I have a (well-deserved) reputation around here for being so fussy and finicky about stories that I put a two-year-old's eating habits to shame.  Just because I found a nit to pick doesn't mean much in the wider world; I am often the only person to dislike something about a story, and the stories I really love seem to get roundly panned by the audience.  (c.f. "The Hortlak," for instance.)

---

More to the point, and returning to a generic 'you', "Blue Eyes" was very well-written.  I did enjoy it right up until I realized it was a true story.  That feels oddly hypocritical, but it's a very visceral response for me.  I'm okay with people doing almost anything for artistic effect, and it won't bother me much, but using real people makes me edgy.  (For example, I didn't mind "The Ghosts of New York" at all because while it used real events, the main character was not any one specific person from the tragedy.)  I think the kicker for me was that "Blue Eyes" went for a sort of ominous ending, hinting that she might well kill again (or at least, she repeats her pre-murder catchphrase while gazing thoughtfully at her street, which feels awfully suggestive of the idea); I know nothing of the actual events other than what Al described in the outro, but that ending felt a bit... rude, if that makes sense.  (I mean, did she ever kill anyone else again?  I could see it happening; prisons often do little to address problems of recidivism, particularly for the mentally ill.)  It felt exploitative, like those "Behind The Music" episodes where they tell about some musician's struggles with gambling/alcohol/adultery/whatever and if the subject is currently doing well, they make all these hints and innuendos that they'll surely fall again in the future.  That's what I meant by "titillation."  One of the pleasures of horror fiction is that little tingle of fear when we trail off into suggestive ellipses regarding future horrors that might yet befall, and I didn't feel it was appropriate to use a real person to evoke that.  Real people are not boogeymen; if even half of the details of the story are true, then this girl was badly damaged and in need of help.  Mental illness is a painful subject, and even in cases where someone is so very badly damaged that they must be restrained for the safety of those around them, pity and sadness seem more in order than putting them up as objects of fear.  I did get some of that through the story, but the ending felt like a straight horror fiction "dun dun DUNNN" moment, which I enjoyed and then, post-revelation, felt horrid about having enjoyed.



JayCaselberg

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Reply #15 on: September 09, 2011, 03:59:50 AM
Hey Scattercat,

That's okay.  We all have our own views.  Not sure about the exploitation angle.  Fiction is, after all, a mirror unto ourselves.  I was fascinated by the case originally and that fascination seriously drove me to write the tale.  The fact that Mary was given a new secret identity and released also stayed with me for a long time.  All speculative fiction, and that includes horror in its several forms, does exactly that...speculate.  As I became immersed in the case, I was naturally drawn to wonder what might have happened. There is true horror in real life. The tentacles take many different and often subtle shapes.

The other thing that I believe good fiction should do, especially short fiction, is to leave people thinking, to have an impact.  To that end, I am gratified that "Blue Eyes" seems to have achieved at least that.

Best,
Caselberg
« Last Edit: September 09, 2011, 04:35:48 AM by JayCaselberg »



yaksox

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Reply #16 on: September 11, 2011, 01:36:48 AM
Good story. Very economical with words. It fits into that Horror in plain sight category where horror really is things like alcoholism, neglectful parenting and poverty. Power and the lack of it.

I only read a couple of comments before writing here but finding out it was based on a true story doesn't bother me at all. In an interesting way, Al's outro becomes part of the story. (I remember as a kid those TV shows on aliens/ghosts that would start off with with 'The following is based on real events' and that'd definitely make it scarier.)
I honestly don't care to know how much of the facts were used in the story. If it was two murders then that's two fixed points but there's still a lot of terrain to cover in between, especially if you're coming from the POV of the killer's head.

Also, fantastic narration. I don't know if it's because there just more people out there podcasting these days (and so willing to do eachother favours) or if the trio of Pods has developed a global dossier of experienced readers, but the fit of word and voice brings a new dimension to the d/load.



Sgarre1

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Reply #17 on: September 11, 2011, 02:20:41 AM
Quote
Also, fantastic narration. I don't know if it's because there just more people out there podcasting these days (and so willing to do eachother favours) or if the trio of Pods has developed a global dossier of experienced readers, but the fit of word and voice brings a new dimension to the d/load.

I actually took note of Jen Williams' apt voice while listening to a story she read for the DARK FICTION audiopod.  I contacted her and she was happy to oblige - I am trying to poach appropriate talent, with various degress of luck.  Also, Dave does have an amazing, annotated dossier for Podcastle, and Ben left me one as well...



yaksox

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Reply #18 on: September 11, 2011, 04:42:27 AM
^ Yeah, things have come a long since senior Eely read every story himself, and did the female voice in a slightly higher tone (lol). :D


Getting back to the story, I should probably be alarmed at my lack of squeamishness about it. Desensitized by news media I guess. If it's not happening to me right here, it's abstract. (Aye, thar's the _real_ horror, right?) And in a way I kind of feel like the story falls outside the horror genre because there was nothing 'unusual' in it, like a demonic automobile.

Best line it it was where the girl says that 'it made her feel alive, and that she'd once heard someone say that about something'. There was no emotion in the writing, or in the character and that's often what we hear psychopaths as being like.

The one small weakness that I picked up was how the girl drew the picture including the doll in her school notebook. And this was what gave her away - the teacher showed this to the police, but how did the teacher know that the doll was a giveaway, and not the girl's imagination?
« Last Edit: September 11, 2011, 05:25:50 AM by yaksox »



Unblinking

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Reply #19 on: September 12, 2011, 02:09:46 PM
The one small weakness that I picked up was how the girl drew the picture including the doll in her school notebook. And this was what gave her away - the teacher showed this to the police, but how did the teacher know that the doll was a giveaway, and not the girl's imagination?


A hunch, I guess.  The very first thing I thought of the first time the doll was mentioned was "Ah, I bet that's how she gets caught."  If I was her teacher, I suspect I'd have had the same hunch and might have taken a moment to make a phone call to follow up with the police about it.



bolddeceiver

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Reply #20 on: September 16, 2011, 11:15:45 PM
I felt like the whole bit about the mom's career was completely unnecessary to the story, and was a bit of a gratuitous jab at a profession which gets a lot of undeserved bad PR (and a rather unbelievable one, too -- I only know a few pro-doms socially, but from what I've heard I doubt there are many out there who would work with their child in the room).



Sgarre1

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Reply #21 on: September 16, 2011, 11:27:20 PM
The truth is not always nice, sadly, nor does it have an agenda...



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Reply #22 on: September 16, 2011, 11:31:15 PM
I felt like the whole bit about the mom's career was completely unnecessary to the story, and was a bit of a gratuitous jab at a profession which gets a lot of undeserved bad PR (and a rather unbelievable one, too -- I only know a few pro-doms socially, but from what I've heard I doubt there are many out there who would work with their child in the room).

In defense of the story - because I am constitutionally incapable of agreeing with anyone, even people who agree with me - the mom is not exactly a pro domme. She's a kinky hooker. Pro dommes almost never have sex with their clients, rarely work out of the home, and usually do well enough not to live in a slum.

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bolddeceiver

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Reply #23 on: September 17, 2011, 04:42:12 PM
The truth is not always nice, sadly, nor does it have an agenda...

But in fiction based on the truth, what facts you choose to present as the pertinent can indeed have an agenda.



sennydreadful

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Reply #24 on: September 20, 2011, 03:26:35 PM
Quote
Also, fantastic narration. I don't know if it's because there just more people out there podcasting these days (and so willing to do eachother favours) or if the trio of Pods has developed a global dossier of experienced readers, but the fit of word and voice brings a new dimension to the d/load.
I actually took note of Jen Williams' apt voice while listening to a story she read for the DARK FICTION audiopod.  I contacted her and she was happy to oblige - I am trying to poach appropriate talent, with various degress of luck.  Also, Dave does have an amazing, annotated dossier for Podcastle, and Ben left me one as well...
Hello all! Just wanted to pop in and say thank you for the kind comments about my narration. It was an interesting story to read aloud, and due to the subject matter, actually rather difficult in places (I guessed it was about Mary Bell almost straight away, having read about the case previously) but very well written.