Author Topic: Escape Artists Metacast  (Read 83764 times)

Sgarre1

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Reply #75 on: October 16, 2013, 05:59:08 PM
I was told to concentrate on what we have planned for the future - because it's easier to get people to support a future if you help them conceive of it, and what they'd be missing - and I also think the idea was to showcase that this isn't about us struggling just to stay static, but that, despite the financial struggles, we still have lots to do and lots of new ideas.

Since it was mentioned - while it's understandable, don't presume that big name authors take much more money than our flat rates - any extra money I spent on big name authors this year was more than mitigated by some big name author stories I was just *given*.



wintermute

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Reply #76 on: October 16, 2013, 06:55:38 PM
So, I've been listening since the early days (back when Escape Pod was in double digits), and I've discovered a lot of great authors through Escape Artists. I've bought books based on reviews on PC, and I've sought out authors I'd never have been aware of, if not for the 'pods. Escape Artists has been very good to me.

And, as was mentioned in the Metacast, if not for Escape Pod, there wouldn't be a DrabbleCast, or probably a Starship Sofa, Cast of Wonders, Toasted Cake, or any other short fiction podcast magazine Or maybe they would, but it's inarguable that the field would be unrecognizable if EP hadn't kicked it off. Escape Artists has been very good for the genre. (Full disclosure: the only fiction podcasts I listen to is the EA ones, due to time constraints)

I used to be moderately active in the fora, commenting on more than half the stories. I stopped a while back, because I stopped having the time, but I figured it was worth stopping by to say that I really appreciate the work you guys do, and if you need my help to keep going, you've got it. I looked at the amount I spent on books this year, and I figure an extra $5/month won't be noticed. I'm sorry I never did this before. All I can say in my defence is that from now on I'll keep on giving you money as long as you're willing to take it. Deal?

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FamilyGuy

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Reply #77 on: October 16, 2013, 07:17:03 PM
I've listen to the casts since '07.  They have all gotten me through tough times.  I'm sorry I haven't contributed financially until now, that will change.  I've just donated a lump sum plus adding a monthly subscription. 

It shouldn't have taken me this long to contribute to such wonderful podcasts.

Jon

When will all the rhetorical questions end?


Fenrix

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Reply #78 on: October 16, 2013, 07:58:14 PM
This was also the reminder that I needed to plunk down my annual financial contribution. It doesn't look like I'll be able to make it to the DC area for the rest of the year, so I can't buy Shawn a margarita in person.  I skipped donating a year when I was out of work, but I think I've made up for that by slush-mucking and pursuing estates. It's worth slushing when you find those pearls. And it's worth chasing estates when you find those awesome agents who respond quickly and positively. I just saw the signed contract on one, so it's time to knuckle down and start the next batch. 

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Sgarre1

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Reply #79 on: October 16, 2013, 08:15:40 PM
You are a treasure!



Igorken

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Reply #80 on: October 16, 2013, 09:11:36 PM
Hi,

I have to say I was annoyed at this cast, so much so that I skipped through most of it in 2 min jumps after the first 5-8 minutes. I heard "please help", a lot of very passionate but not at all interesting rambling, and not much else (oh yeah and a story somewhere in the middle). It may be that I missed some things because of this - and in that case I apologise for asking again though I feel the format of this plea is somewhat to blame. Perhaps a written summary with some basic points could be made for those of us who'd like an overview of the facts.

And while the cry for help came across as very strong (the strongest I've ever heard on these casts), I'm not really sure why you suddenly need help now and how much is needed. My thoughts are somewhat similar to Moritz' above.
- How much is the annual income and how much is needed to keep doing what you want/need to do to keep the podcasts going? I'd like to know what the gap is.
- It can never truly be an all or nothing proposition. Of course nobody wants this, but if it came down to one cast or none at all, keeping just a single podcast would obviously be preferred. There are no doubt also things the podcasts could do without if it came down to either that or disappearing altogeteher.
- So how much is needed annually to maintain one cast, how much for two and how much for all three?
- Extras (bonus content) for supporters are always nice and can be a good incentive, but the whole podcast is what most of us want and donate for, not for extras - why suddenly this descision? Does your research suggest adding this seriously increases donations, thus improving the whole?
- In addition to that if you're struggling so badly that you might stop operations in a few weeks, why do you want to expand?

I've been a fan for years, donated a couple of times (recently too) and truly appreciate the offers you all make for these wonderful podcasts.
I'm considering an additional donation because your passion is understood and appreciated, but a little more info would surely help convince me.

I apologise if I'm coming across as overly negative and thank you for any additional info you can provide.



eytanz

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Reply #81 on: October 16, 2013, 10:03:44 PM
Igorken - I don't know the answers to any of your questions, because while I do volunteer work for EA, I don't participate in any of the financial decisions. So I can say the following without a conflict of interest:

I don't think those questions need to be answered. When you go to a bookstore and buy a book, do you ask how the publishers balance their ledgers? When you go to the cinema to see a movie, do you only agree to pay the ticket price if someone explains the rationale behind how the studio spent its marketing budget? When you buy food, do you ask whether the store would be willing to reduce the choice it offered if it ran into financial difficulty before buying any produce?

It doesn't matter if the payment is mandatory or optional. What you should be giving money for is the product. If you like EA's stories and want them to continue, then pay. If you do not feel they contribute enough to you, don't pay. The fact that EA doesn't require you to pay in order to enjoy their product doesn't suddenly make you more entitled to get information about their inner workings than any other producer of content.

Transparency is nice. If EA decides to go down a more transparent route, I certainly won't object. But saying that you think they need to do so in order to convince you to donate means that you apparently don't think the hours of quality storytelling they produce each month are worth paying for on their own right. Which is entirely fine; that's a perfectly valid opinion. But if that's the case, just don't donate. Don't ask them to jump through all sort of hoops.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2013, 10:18:51 PM by eytanz »



Alasdair5000

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Reply #82 on: October 16, 2013, 10:06:42 PM
Go here, read this. It's 18 lines long. It gives you the gist. Other people will be along shortly I suspect to go into more detail. This is as much as I can type and stay polite.

http://www.alasdairstuart.com/?p=1611



P.C. Haring

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Reply #83 on: October 16, 2013, 10:41:50 PM
Here's the thing- 

We don't want to shut down.  Every single person who works to put a show out each week is here because they love what they do and they believe in the mission.  We believe it means something to us, and to you all as a listener.  For as long as we are running, and open, we want to continue to put out the best product we can for you.  That means better quality stories, better quality productions and more.  But the point of the Metacast was that if things did not change, we would have to shut down.  We would have no choice. 

Cutting a podcast or two out to save costs would be a potential solution.   But it only works if there’s no demand for the podcast.  Our metrics show that we have tens of thousands of listeners to every show.    Now if we chose to cut one at random… say Escape Pod.  How many listeners/donors/subscribers would we lose?  If we cut out escape pod for example where the majority of our listeners and donors are... we lose 33% of the product, 40% of the cost and 50% of the revenue, for an example.  That doesn’t help us. It would just delay the inevitable. 

The fundamental reality is that, as a listener, you are required to pay nothing to experience our content.  However, in order to provide content to you we are required to pay others.  It would be a lot different if we went to a more traditional pay model where you would not be allowed access to any of our content (product) until you purchased it.  However, that runs contrary to our mission and the original concept of this company. 

As far as our financial needs, since 2011 and projecting through the end of 2013, we incur an average of $42,000 in costs per year.  That covers stories, staff payments, web hosting, advertising costs, merchant fees, tax costs, and more.  That is also the extent of the financial situation I intend to reveal at this time.  If we intend to expand, we will need more funds to make that happen.

You're right, it did come on suddenly and we've been aware of this problem for several months but (as I said in the metacast), we've been trying to reorganize and trim our costs as much as possible.  We know the economy sucks right now.  We know that we fell off the horse a while back and it hurt our relationship with you all.  We had hoped that as we corrected the problems we were in control of, donations would increase.  They did not.  So here we are.
 

Paul Haring
Publisher and Treasurer, Escape Artists Inc.


PedalBikah

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Reply #84 on: October 16, 2013, 11:05:00 PM
Count me amongst the group that wants to hear all three.  I'd never expect NPR to tell me what they do with all the money, and I feel the same way here. The EA provide an incredible service with minimal and unobtrusive  calls for cash. Why stress over the back room management? Just sit back and enjoy the stories, and then sack up and set up a donation subscription. The worst that'll happen is the stories will stop and then you'll have to cancel the subscription.



Windup

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Reply #85 on: October 17, 2013, 02:50:11 AM

Well, we'd rather keep growing than start shrinking, you know?  I mean, yes, if it comes down to total collapse, I suppose it's possible that those who are left with the pieces might try to reboot on a smaller scale, but that's not exactly a first option, you know?  If your business is struggling, you try to earn more money first and start reducing headcount after, ne?  And the better your product, the more you can 'ask' for it, hence the desire to bump all three 'casts to pro rates and pay readers and all that jazz. 


I was impressed by that aspect of the plan -- the idea that EA should come out of this stronger, with plans to improve the product, rather than "cut until it fits."  Because like they say, "you can only cut to zero." 

That spirit played a big part in my decision to throw in a one-time donation on top of my subscription increase. 

"My whole job is in the space between 'should be' and 'is.' It's a big space."


MCWagner

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Reply #86 on: October 17, 2013, 03:04:43 AM
I'm more used to being on the other side of Devil's Advocate arguments, but if I may offer a word:

I have no knowledge of the internal workings of Escape Pod (especially the finances), but I have previously been a part of the inner workings of a tangentially similar body: the running of a popular media convention.  While there, I learned that in business, especially in the entertainment business and especially in volunteer-run (or sort-of-volunteer-run) organizations, stagnancy = death.  Especially during financial troubles, counter-intuitive as that may be.  While it's a vast simplification, one way to think of it is: "Hey everyone, you know that way we were running things that wasn't quite panning out?  Please donate money so that we can keep doing it that way."

Hunkering down and circling the wagons to weather financial difficulties may seem the obvious thing to do, but it's nearly impossible to break out of that condition, especially with entertainment.  "More of the same" is the recipe for slow death:  the years we didn't try for anything new at our convention were the years that saw the smallest growth.  The years we tried something new, even if that event in particular failed, were the years that saw a recovering growth of attendance.

What Escape Artists is doing is showing that it's still young and vital and has ideas to continue upping their game if they're given the chance to continue.  Moreover, their ideas for expansion are modest and well reasoned, designed to bring more prestige, high level authors, and thus a larger audience to the 'casts, and moving back toward self-supporting.  This is instead of getting a temporary crutch from the current listeners, or "eating their seed corn" by shrinking from 3 to 1 podcasts.  (Which is almost exactly what Sears is currently doing.)

For myself, I've been listening from somewhere back near episode 30 on Pseudopod.  Saw me through a particularly impoverishing year of grad school and two low-paying postdocs.  Now that I've gotten the heck out of research and into a decent-paying job I figure the $2 subscription is the least I can do for services rendered.  (It would be more, but I'm also planning a move, a wedding, a honeymoon, a house, and possibly a career change in the relatively near future.  $$ouch$$)



silber

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Reply #87 on: October 17, 2013, 03:50:01 AM
Not a usual poster but thought I'd login after the metacast to say I've subscribed and thanks for the good work you guys do!



evrgrn_monster

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Reply #88 on: October 17, 2013, 04:30:34 AM
Bam, subscribed.

I am more than happy to help out. When I was poor, sad, or lonely, you guys were there for me with free stories and a sense of a community. Now that I am in a better position, it's only fair that I do what I can.

Also, that story you guys slide in there? So awesome! Hilarious, but heart breaking. That's worth my $5 this month, for sure.


Scattercat

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Reply #89 on: October 17, 2013, 04:52:00 AM
Also, that story you guys slide in there? So awesome! Hilarious, but heart breaking. That's worth my $5 this month, for sure.

Tina Connolly is good times and good people.  I was a little blindsided by a deadline and had to put out a call to the authors I know to find a flash piece fast.  (Then I had to regret my decision as I suddenly had like sixty stories to read in about a day and a half.)  Tina was the winner of the "make Nathan smile" contest.  (I like my stories to have barbs.)



Rednaxela

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Reply #90 on: October 17, 2013, 05:03:10 AM
Well... I've been a listener for roughly a year, and haven't subscribed till now. As such, in addition to the $5/mo subscription I'll throw in $60 more too.

I hope things work out. Thanks for the great work you folks at EA do.



Myst

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Reply #91 on: October 17, 2013, 05:49:26 AM
I am soo Sorry. I am one of those that used to subscribe then Paypall did something odd and the monthly donations were halted. I kept meaning to come back and click the donate button. I would be reminded of it in places other than my computer I guess that is the danger of portable media playing devices.

That is all in the past now, before coming in here I clicked the $10 monthly donation button. I love what Escape Artists as a group does. I want to be around listening to your 50 year celebratory holocast.

Thank you for all you do
M. Yust 



bizbrig

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Reply #92 on: October 17, 2013, 05:58:18 AM
<- New listener. I was already planning on subscribing.

Stories keep us afloat; we should keep them afloat.



Moritz

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Reply #93 on: October 17, 2013, 06:56:05 AM
can someone help me with this paypal question? on the site, there is a subscription and a one time donation button. Can I make a subscription with an amount that is different to the one given in the list? The one time donation suggests this, as you can click a button saying "monthly". After I did this, I do not see any information on my paypal account about such a subscription, only the one time donation.

 ???



Djinndustries

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Reply #94 on: October 17, 2013, 01:32:55 PM
I don't think those questions need to be answered. When you go to a bookstore and buy a book, do you ask how the publishers balance their ledgers? When you go to the cinema to see a movie, do you only agree to pay the ticket price if someone explains the rationale behind how the studio spent its marketing budget? When you buy food, do you ask whether the store would be willing to reduce the choice it offered if it ran into financial difficulty before buying any produce?

It doesn't matter if the payment is mandatory or optional. What you should be giving money for is the product. If you like EA's stories and want them to continue, then pay. If you do not feel they contribute enough to you, don't pay. The fact that EA doesn't require you to pay in order to enjoy their product doesn't suddenly make you more entitled to get information about their inner workings than any other producer of content.

Transparency is nice. If EA decides to go down a more transparent route, I certainly won't object. But saying that you think they need to do so in order to convince you to donate means that you apparently don't think the hours of quality storytelling they produce each month are worth paying for on their own right. Which is entirely fine; that's a perfectly valid opinion. But if that's the case, just don't donate. Don't ask them to jump through all sort of hoops.


Go here, read this. It's 18 lines long. It gives you the gist. Other people will be along shortly I suspect to go into more detail. This is as much as I can type and stay polite.

Nobody likes being poor and asking for money is one of the most difficult, heartrending things that someone can do. Matweller notes as much. I totally sympathize.

That said, your comments are not anything resembling constructive replies at all and I would have expected you both, as a defender of forumites and an editor, to reply in a more levelheaded way.

You know nothing about Igorken (except maybe his IP address). It is quite possible that Igorken has the money to make you free from financial obligations for one or more years. Who knows? Not everyone is in the $2 per month category. But, I can say that people that have that kind of money don't typically get it by investing in unsustainable ventures.

If he (?) extrapolated the costs given in the metacast (52 stories per podcast, 156 total, average $12 for a middle of the road anthology of maybe 15-20 stories...let's say 15 stories for ease of math, and since you're not middle of the road, let's call it $15.99, $16, like a Year's Best Anthology of __________) we'd get about 10 anthologies worth of material or $160.  So, maybe he was going to donate $160.

On the other hand, maybe he wanted to donate invest $10,000 and wanted to know that the money would be used in a constructive and sustainable way. Would you begrudge him the request for transparency then? None of his questions are unusual for a typical investor.

He even apologized if he came across as too direct and you flamed him. Not cool. 

I'll put my donation in the box once I hear back from Paul.



Fenrix

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Reply #95 on: October 17, 2013, 01:36:51 PM
If anyone's in the investment category (in the thousands, as identified above) and wants more details, then an one-to-one conversation (probably by phone) is a better venue. PM any of us and we'll make a conversation happen.

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eytanz

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Reply #96 on: October 17, 2013, 01:58:30 PM
Maybe Igorken was, indeed, planning on solving all of EA's financial woes with one massive donation. Maybe he or she wasn't. You're right, I don't know. I do know what I - as a donor myself - consider to be a reasonable level of transparency. I do not feel that the fact that I'm a moderator means that I am not entitled to express my opinion.

If you feel that my post was not levelheaded, or that it was a "flame", then you have different standards for what constitutes flaming than I do. We allow all sorts of disagreements here. That includes my disagreement with Igorken and your disagreement with me.

I should point out that at no point did the metacast ask for large sums of money. It asked for small amounts of money, that the editors - and most of the listeners who posted - believe is an appropriate level for what EA produces. My response was specifically framed within the context of this metacast, that this thread is a discussion of.



amalmohtar

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Reply #97 on: October 17, 2013, 02:00:12 PM
Hey guys,

I've subscribed and signal-boosted as much as I can.

Following some things that have been raised in this thread:

- I don't need a break-down of EA's costs in order to donate. The quality of the product that I've been getting for the last 3 years for free, and the fact that I'm a writer receiving money for the stories they broadcast, are incentive enough for me to want to support EA.

- That said, from a fundraising-strategy perspective, it is REALLY helpful to have a clear goal to be working towards -- a solid figure to shoot for in terms of subscriber base increase, something with a gauge that we can see increasing, something to point people towards so that they can SEE the difference they're making with their donations and subscriptions. Right now, the plea is extremely urgent (EA might close by the end of the year! That's only two and a half months away!) but also extremely nebulous (how hard do we have to work and/or how much do we have to give to save it?). I know it would be easier for a shameless extrovert like myself to signal boost if I could say things like "EA is halfway to their goal" etc.

Basically I just want to be as effective as possible in raising awareness about this. Having a TL;DR post up is helpful, anyway.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2013, 04:25:29 PM by amalmohtar »



davidthygod

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Reply #98 on: October 17, 2013, 02:06:40 PM

I only recently discovered Escape Pod, and I found out about Pseudopod yesterday in the metacast.  I am going to donate on faith, but I am going to be annoyed, if I donate and you still shut down end of the year. 

The man is clear in his mind, but his soul is mad.


HeadFull

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Reply #99 on: October 17, 2013, 02:18:38 PM
no EA in 2014?! That is an alternative universe horror worthy of Pseudopod.
Subscribing right now (sorry it's taken me so long). Long live the pod!