Feedback on feedback? how meta

[Gamercow]

If I had one suggestion for Bill, it would be to read through his script a few times out loud to himself.  I have the same problem of pausing in odd places, and find that helps me.

[Sandikal]

The feedback gets better with each episode. 

[Loz]

I agree with Sandikal. My own issue is more about what the point of it is. Does it work to encourage people that find the EA podcasts but who aren't on the boards to join? On the latest episode it was two comments from the thread about the latest Union Dues story. I'm not afraid to admit to my shallowness of getting a little moment of pleasure when something I wrote is read out but comics phased out their letters pages when the net rose to replace them as a way for people to disagree with one another and having Bill just read out a couple of people's comments without at least someone from EA or the writer or reader reply to issues raised as necessary seems a little silly.

[Talia]

Feedback has been standard for EP/PC for a long time (EP just took a bit of a hiatus). It's also common practice for some other podcasts like Drabblecast. Its just a way to give a feel to what some other people thought of the previous story. Definitely an enticement to visit the forum if you want to hear more of the discussion.

[eytanz]

Feedback has been standard for EP/PC for a long time (EP just took a bit of a hiatus). It's also common practice for some other podcasts like Drabblecast. Its just a way to give a feel to what some other people thought of the previous story. Definitely an enticement to visit the forum if you want to hear more of the discussion.

Actually, drabblecast has quit doing feedback a few months back.

I really like the feedback segments - I think they definitely do entice more people to the forums (that's what brought me here, back in the day), and they also entice forum members to participate in the discussion. Also, I think it's just nice to have a positive reinforcement for good feedback, in addition to discouraging/shutting down inappropriate commentary.

[Talia]

Feedback has been standard for EP/PC for a long time (EP just took a bit of a hiatus). It's also common practice for some other podcasts like Drabblecast. Its just a way to give a feel to what some other people thought of the previous story. Definitely an enticement to visit the forum if you want to hear more of the discussion.

Actually, drabblecast has quit doing feedback a few months back.

Huh, and I hadn't noticed. I guess that says something. :p

[Boggled Coriander]

Bill's feedback reading for EP265 was the best yet.

[Scattercat]

I think they definitely do entice more people to the forums (that's what brought me here, back in the day), and they also entice forum members to participate in the discussion. Also, I think it's just nice to have a positive reinforcement for good feedback, in addition to discouraging/shutting down inappropriate commentary.

I came to the forums only because they shut down blog comments.  :-P  I can't not share my mind-shattering insights with the world.  It would be cruel.

However, the feedback segment is fun and it may well be a good way to get people to come to the forums, I think; especially if they need to argue with someone who's clearly completely wrong about everything.  I suspect the main utility would be in the small encouragement to post thoughtful and constructive commentary in the hopes of being singled out with that little nod of noteworthiness.  "I liked it it was good" or "This story sucked" without further elucidation are both unhelpful comments, and making it clear that the Official Position endorses more thorough discussion is one way to try and shape the culture of a given community. 

[Listener]

To me the value of the feedback is to get a pulse on what others thought of a story. If you loved it and others loved it, then maybe you're on the right path and you'll seek out more by that author. If you loved it and others hated it, maybe you need to re-listen and figure out WHY you loved it. If everyone disliked it... well, there's a certain collective schadenfreude in knowing that everyone else got hurt just as much as you did. Makes you feel less alone. But if you hated it and everyone else liked it... feedback like that bothers me the most because it makes me feel like I missed something.

Case in point: there's a certain author who's very popular in genre fiction right now. His/her stories are appearing everywhere. But I have only read/heard two that I actually liked. The others ranged from middling to "make it stop!" This author has gone to Clarion West, has won awards, and is well on his/her way to becoming a successful full-time writer (if s/he isn't already). I use feedback (on the shows and on the forums) to try and figure out what exactly I am missing about his/her writing that makes everyone like it but me... well, NOT like it. I haven't found it yet.

Plus, yeah, there's a certain je ne sais quois about hearing your name in the feedback segment. It was very gratifying when mine was included in the very first feedback segment for Podcastle. When your feedback makes it into the segment, it makes you feel like you can influence the opinions of others... which is quite a powerful feeling.

[stePH]

However, the feedback segment is fun and it may well be a good way to get people to come to the forums, I think; especially if they need to argue with someone who's clearly completely wrong about everything.  I suspect the main utility would be in the small encouragement to post thoughtful and constructive commentary in the hopes of being singled out with that little nod of noteworthiness.  "I liked it it was good" or "This story sucked" without further elucidation are both unhelpful comments, and making it clear that the Official Position endorses more thorough discussion is one way to try and shape the culture of a given community. 

And yet, strangely, I got on PodCastle feedback just for saying "I liked this story." (Though what PC episode it was on, and which story I was commenting on, have both been forgotten.)

[deflective]

in keeping with the journalism of the day, Steve followed a 'both sides' version of feedback when he was doing it.  a couple people have said that they posted opinions they didn't really believe in order to hear their nicks during feedback.

[Talia]

Well, that's lame...

[Heradel]

However, the feedback segment is fun and it may well be a good way to get people to come to the forums, I think; especially if they need to argue with someone who's clearly completely wrong about everything.  I suspect the main utility would be in the small encouragement to post thoughtful and constructive commentary in the hopes of being singled out with that little nod of noteworthiness.  "I liked it it was good" or "This story sucked" without further elucidation are both unhelpful comments, and making it clear that the Official Position endorses more thorough discussion is one way to try and shape the culture of a given community. 

And yet, strangely, I got on PodCastle feedback just for saying "I liked this story." (Though what PC episode it was on, and which story I was commenting on, have both been forgotten.)

I. Well. Hrm.

That probably means something then.

[stePH]

However, the feedback segment is fun and it may well be a good way to get people to come to the forums, I think; especially if they need to argue with someone who's clearly completely wrong about everything.  I suspect the main utility would be in the small encouragement to post thoughtful and constructive commentary in the hopes of being singled out with that little nod of noteworthiness.  "I liked it it was good" or "This story sucked" without further elucidation are both unhelpful comments, and making it clear that the Official Position endorses more thorough discussion is one way to try and shape the culture of a given community. 

And yet, strangely, I got on PodCastle feedback just for saying "I liked this story." (Though what PC episode it was on, and which story I was commenting on, have both been forgotten.)

I. Well. Hrm.

That probably means something then.

It might; I think Dave said "...and stePH just said 'I liked this story.' If you know stePH, you'll understand how significant that is." Or something like that.

[DKT]

Heh. Well. Yes. Probably. I'm trying to remember what story the feedback was for that episode...but drawing a blank. (It was on the Curandero and the Swede episode.)

But since people seem curious - yeah, generally when I do feedback I try to pick things people have said that are interesting, intelligent, or funny. Mostly, things that make me smile or think. I'm not always balanced - I tend to run more positive comments than critical comments (although, since I think we're generally awesome, I'd say it's a fair representation, yo!) That said, I do try and give people room to say they didn't like a story (and why) if they didn't, especially if an episode seemed to not go over well. One thing I usually don't pick up is when listeners try and tell the author how they wanted the story to be written or what would've made it more awesome.

But yeah - personally, I love doing the feedback segments. I think it help builds community and gets people excited to discuss the stories, and I love reading the discussions. When EP stopped doing feedback, I was sad, and I'm happy it's back now.

[kibitzer]

I actually don't like the feedback on any of the 'casts. Two reasons: (1) it becomes a wit competition ("Your Majesty, you're like a big jam donut with cream on top"), (2) I hang out on the forums anyway so I already know the feedback.

I fully understand it being more appreciated by non-forumites. Just my $0.02.

[stePH]

Heh. Well. Yes. Probably. I'm trying to remember what story the feedback was for that episode...but drawing a blank. (It was on the Curandero and the Swede episode.)

"One Paper Airplane Graffito Love Note".

Steph just said, "I liked this story a lot." Yeah. That's all stePH said about this story. If you know stePH from the Podcastle forums you'll understand why I'm using that quote. If you don't, well, you really should come visit him and us, at forums-dot-escapeartists-dot-net. We don't need to know your real name, but feel free to P.M. stePH your personal and private confessions.

  Man, you crazy.

[kibitzer]

You're a real stirrer DKT! 

[Scattercat]

This is why I think the feedback is a good thing.  I just didn't have the words to describe it before.  It's a manifestation of WWIC.

[Wilson Fowlie]

That's a really good article.

[Scattercat]

That's a really good article.

Isn't it?  I've been sharing it all over because I thought it was just a really nice encapsulation of why things work or don't work on the Internet.

[KenK]

I actually don't like the feedback on any of the 'casts. Two reasons: (1) it becomes a wit competition ("Your Majesty, you're like a big jam donut with cream on top"), (2) I hang out on the forums anyway so I already know the feedback.

I fully understand it being more appreciated by non-forumites. Just my $0.02.

Totally agree. Those that get a thrill having their name mentioned are indeed a sad lot. Shutting off my player when it comes on is how I deal with that issue. If I desire other listeners views on a story why I just read them on the boards. Having someone read the comments they liked best serves no purpose as far as I can see.
My two pennies worth.

[CryptoMe]

I actually don't like the feedback on any of the 'casts. Two reasons: (1) it becomes a wit competition ("Your Majesty, you're like a big jam donut with cream on top"), (2) I hang out on the forums anyway so I already know the feedback.

I fully understand it being more appreciated by non-forumites. Just my $0.02.

Totally agree. Those that get a thrill having their name mentioned are indeed a sad lot. Shutting off my player when it comes on is how I deal with that issue. If I desire other listeners views on a story why I just read them on the boards. Having someone read the comments they liked best serves no purpose as far as I can see.
My two pennies worth.

1) I get a thrill out of hearing the names of people I only know from the forums mentioned in the feedback section. How sad does that make me? 

2) I particularly enjoyed the feedback before I joined the forums. It is a great way to get a sense of the opinions without having to spend time reading them all. Unfortunately, now that I am here, I'm hooked. But I still enjoy the feedback section, because I can't get to all the posts all the time.

[Wilson Fowlie]

Shutting off my player when it comes on is how I deal with that issue.

I think that's unfortunate. Not because you're missing the feedback - I know it's not for everyone - but because you're also missing "our quote this week" at the end.  I always enjoy hearing what the editors have found to go with the story.  They almost always surprise and delight me.  It's like getting a few bonus seconds of the story.

[Gamercow]

The feedback is a great way to hook people into other episodes.  "Wow, this story got tons of great mentions on the feedback, I should check it out!"