Life on Mars

[SFEley]

Why do you Brits get to have all the really good shows?

My wife and I just discovered Life on Mars a little while ago.  We're five episodes in now.  This is now my favorite cop show -- not that I've ever been a big fan of the genre, but this one's special.  I'm putting this in the miscellaneous board because it's not entirely clear whether it's science fiction.  (If it becomes clear later, don't tell me.)  >8->

For the rest of us Americans who've never heard of this show: Detective Inspector Sam Tyler is a present-day cop with a very by-the-book attitude.  He gets hit by a car in the first episode and wakes up in 1973.  Oddly, he still has a job, and everyone treats him like he's supposed to be there.  He believes he's in a coma and hallucinating the whole thing (and there's some supporting evidence for this) -- but he isn't completely sure.  Of course his early attempts to treat people like they aren't real don't endear him to his new colleagues.  He ends up having to do his job all over again, only with primitive procedures, a deeply sexist and racist culture, and an abrasive boss who thinks nothing of beating the crap out of prisoners or planting evidence on suspects he thinks are guilty.  He stands up to all of this and tries to do things the modern way -- which, again, doesn't make him any friends.

There's a lot that's exaggerated about the show.  I can only imagine how the concept came about: a bunch of writers needing to come up with another detective show, and saying "It's too bad we can't get away with intimidation and fistfights every five minutes like they used to do on shows in the 70s.  ...Hey, wait a minute!"

But it's good.  There's real character conflict here -- you relate to Tyler, but you also sympathize with the other cops who can't stand him because he keeps getting in their way.  It's all good guys with diametrically opposed viewpoints.  And there's enough of a Twin Peaks vibe about the whole thing to give it a sense of darkness and mystery.  Did he really go back in time?  Is he in a coma?  Or is he just insane?  There are also some really funny bits, but it's certainly not the comedy I was expecting when someone first gave me the two-sentence nutshell.  It's quite serious.

If it hits BBC America again, I recommend tuning in.  (Or get it the way I did.  You can probably guess.)  It's well worth the time.

[Roney]

I think this is a case of the grass always being greener on the other side of the Atlantic.  I probably spend more time watching American shows that I've, uh... waited to be released on DVD than I do on broadcast UK TV.

But Life on Mars is a good 'un.  We've been waiting for the second season more eagerly than third season Dr Who (which must also be due soon).  I'll not spoil anything, just say that the quality hasn't slipped so far.

I can only imagine how the concept came about: a bunch of writers needing to come up with another detective show, and saying "It's too bad we can't get away with intimidation and fistfights every five minutes like they used to do on shows in the 70s.  ...Hey, wait a minute!"

Close.  According to the S1 DVD, the writers had been sent away to come up with ideas for new shows.  The conversation went something like:
"We should write down some safe ideas before we get too wacky."
"Fine, let's have a cop show.  They seem easy to sell."
"Ugh, not another cop show.  I'd rather cut off my arm than get stuck writing one of those."
"I know what you mean.  They're so dull.  I don't think I've seen one that was any fun since the 70s."

It still took the best part of 10 years for it to get commissioned.  I think some of their other ideas were developed first.

[Brian Reilly]

It's the one-liners that make the show. Especially when they come from the less-than-PC DCI Hunt.

"He's got fingers in more pies than a leper on a cookery course"

"He's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot"

" I don't like this. Gene Hunt smashes doors down, he does not pick girlie locks! "

"Anything happens to this motor, I'll come around your houses and stamp on all your toys. Got it? Good kids. "

" I think you've forgotten who you're talking to.
An overweight, over-the-hill, nicotine-stained, borderline-alcoholic homophobe with a superiority complex and an unhealthy obsession with male bonding?
You make that sound like a bad thing. "

Being a good-quality British drama, there are only eight shows a season. Season Two is almost over

Most British TV sucks. I've watched a ton of American SF. A torrent, you might say

I've heard a US version is planned.

[Alasdair5000]

It's the one-liners that make the show. Especially when they come from the less-than-PC DCI Hunt.

"He's got fingers in more pies than a leper on a cookery course"

"He's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot"

" I don't like this. Gene Hunt smashes doors down, he does not pick girlie locks! "

"Anything happens to this motor, I'll come around your houses and stamp on all your toys. Got it? Good kids. "

" I think you've forgotten who you're talking to.
An overweight, over-the-hill, nicotine-stained, borderline-alcoholic homophobe with a superiority complex and an unhealthy obsession with male bonding?
You make that sound like a bad thing. "

   I'd completely forgotten that last one:)  Two zingers from series two:

'You are surrounded by armed bastards!'

'Right, let's nick someone from the 'we don't like you' list.'

   As well as a US remake there's also a rumoured '80s-set spin off called Ashes to Ashes, focussing on Gene.  The thought of a Manchester-set Miami Vice starring the most monstrous TV cop in recent memory can ONLY be a good thing.  As, I suspect can the fact that John Simm went straight from the second series of this to playing a character in the new series of Who.

   And yeah, most English TV is rubbish although just recently things have taken an uptick.  Primeval just finished over here and whilst it was supremely pulpy and daft it was also huge fun:)  Similarly, the Inspector Morse follow up, Lewis has just finished its first run and was excellent, really smart, odd crime drama.  So, as the Third Watch theme tune once said, there is hope.

[SFEley]

I've heard a US version is planned.

Ye gods, not again. 

Good British-to-American transplantation has been achieved exactly once.  Queer as Folk is quite good in the US version.  Every other good British show I've seen that they've tried doing here has sucked dalmatians through a garden hose.  (The American version of Coupling being the all-time worst, of course.)

[ClintMemo]

I've heard a US version is planned.

Ye gods, not again. 

Good British-to-American transplantation has been achieved exactly once.  Queer as Folk is quite good in the US version.  Every other good British show I've seen that they've tried doing here has sucked dalmatians through a garden hose.  (The American version of Coupling being the all-time worst, of course.)

So, I'm guessing you're not a fan of "the Office"?

[SFEley]

So, I'm guessing you're not a fan of "the Office"?

*thinks*

*clears throat grudgingly*

Okay, okay.  Two good shows.  (Though, yeah, I've never watched it a whole lot in either version.  Not that it's not funny, just not enough time.)

[Bdoomed]

I've heard a US version is planned.

Ye gods, not again. 

Good British-to-American transplantation has been achieved exactly once.  Queer as Folk is quite good in the US version.  Every other good British show I've seen that they've tried doing here has sucked dalmatians through a garden hose.  (The American version of Coupling being the all-time worst, of course.)

Whos Line is it Anyways is a great show!  tho i doubt it falls under the same category... it is a british-american translation and its as funny as ever!

[Jim]

And don't forget that All in the Family was based on the British sitcom 'Til Death Do Us Part.

[Bdoomed]

steve's just been trashed... 3 times over.
pwnt
we love you steve!

[ClintMemo]

I'm sure British TV is no different than any other art form - 95% of it is crap.
American TV is no different.

[lowky]

I'm sure British TV is no different than any other art form - 95% of it is crap.
American TV is no different.

I don't know I think American TV might be closer to 99.99% crap.  I think American Idol is now on 3 days a week for f@#! sake.

[ClintMemo]

I'm sure British TV is no different than any other art form - 95% of it is crap.
American TV is no different.

I don't know I think American TV might be closer to 99.99% crap.  I think American Idol is now on 3 days a week for f@#! sake.

If you limit yourself to the big four networks, that may just be true.
I take great pride in saying that I have seen more than an accidental snippet of American Idol, or Survivor or The Biggest Loser or... the rest of those.

[Startrekwiki]

If you limit yourself to the big four networks, that may just be true.

There is also other countries. Canadian TV (a good percentage of our channels are American) also abides by the "99.9% crap" rule. Except for some of our CBC content, that can be seen just about anywhere on our TVs. That's why I listen to PodCasts.

[Bdoomed]

Yea, I've stopped watching tv (relatively) because i rarely find anything worth watching.  I have 3 shows that i bother watching, and other than that, I cannot find anything worthwhile.  Discovery and History sometimes have some great stuff on, and i just loooove the Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy (Cartoon Network)...

But the only shows i try to see are 24, Heroes, and South Park

and then i listen to podcasts... so much better! (the last episode of Stranger Things--Discontent-- had some SERIOUS audio problems! )

[FNH]

That's why I listen to PodCasts.

You got that one right!  I broke from TV when I found myself watch an Australian Soap Opera called Neighbours that was repeating the same script ( a treasure hunt ) but with differn't characters.  Thats was the final straw.  Switched it off.

Went to radio for a long time. Non commercial stations because the adverts drove me nuts.  Then... I found podcasts.  Content I want, when I want it.  Go Podcasting!

[lowky]

I'm sure British TV is no different than any other art form - 95% of it is crap.
American TV is no different.

I don't know I think American TV might be closer to 99.99% crap.  I think American Idol is now on 3 days a week for f@#! sake.

If you limit yourself to the big four networks, that may just be true.
I take great pride in saying that I have seen more than an accidental snippet of American Idol, or Survivor or The Biggest Loser or... the rest of those.

I am assuming you meant to say have not in your statement above.  I personally still stand by my statement of 99% of it being crap.  How many home shopping networks do we really need?  How many feeds of ESPN--When did poker become a sport anyways?  Yes there are a few shows I used to try to watch, but I watch so little TV that I just wait for the box sets for the shows I like and catch up all at once.  I read or listen to podcasts mostly for entertainment.

[lowky]

If you limit yourself to the big four networks, that may just be true.

There is also other countries. Canadian TV (a good percentage of our channels are American) also abides by the "99.9% crap" rule. Except for some of our CBC content, that can be seen just about anywhere on our TVs. That's why I listen to PodCasts.

I wish I could still get CBC here in Detroit area.  Due to the number of Canadians watching U.S. channels instead, CBC cut the broadcast power as a cost cutting measure in Windsor, and now even with cable signal strength seems poor, and without cable forget it.  I used to enjoy Hockey Night in Canada.  I also enjoyed watching their childrens' programing as a child, and when I was watching a friends child while his wife was in the hospital a few years ago, tried to share some of it with my friend's child, only to find it was unavailable to him through his satelite provider . 

[Startrekwiki]

do you receive the CBC FM radio signal?

[lowky]

do you receive the CBC FM radio signal?

seems like i get a cbc radio station somewhere in the 80's/low 90's of the dial, can't remember frequency (too lazy to look right now).  Daytime seems to be mostly classical music, and at night I know they sometimes play an electronic show, that features stuff like skinny puppy etc.

[Startrekwiki]

Then you must be receiving CBC radio 2. Try the station at 99.1, FM.

[Heradel]

Yea, I've stopped watching tv (relatively) because i rarely find anything worth watching.  I have 3 shows that i bother watching, and other than that, I cannot find anything worthwhile.  Discovery and History sometimes have some great stuff on, and i just loooove the Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy (Cartoon Network)...

But the only shows i try to see are 24, Heroes, and South Park

I don't really agree. I think there's more good TV in the last year and a bit than there has been in a while. Granted, it may not be shaped for the same audience that SF has, but it's still there. Grey's Anatomy, Scrubs (the musical episode especially), Boston Legal, Tudors, and Curb Your Enthusiasm for example. The last two are on Showtime and HBO respectively, which limit their (legal) market. I'm not saying there isn't bad TV out there, but don't discount the medium yet.

[Bdoomed]

i like scrubs...
i just dont really watch tv anymore.  durin dinner ill watch something, which usually amounts to Scrubs, Jeopardy, and the Simpsons
ive seen some of Curb Your Enthusiasm, and i liked it, i just dont feel like keepin up with it.
dont know anything about Grey's Anatomy...

basically im just not that big on tv.  i have other, more useless things to do!

[Heradel]

The other nice thing about BBC series is that they End. There isn't the pull to make them last as long as possible, even into the shark-jumping bits (Doctor Who aside, though it does manage to un-jump as much as it has jumped at times) that American series seem to fairly universally share. Which is, coincidentally, why I was relieved to hear Ronald D. Moore say Galactica will be wrapping up fairly soon.

So the Life On Mars finale is Tuesday.

[SFEley]

The other nice thing about BBC series is that they End. There isn't the pull to make them last as long as possible, even into the shark-jumping bits (Doctor Who aside, though it does manage to un-jump as much as it has jumped at times) that American series seem to fairly universally share.

Largely true from what I've seen, although the end of Coupling did get somewhat bizarre. 

I just wish the British series I liked had decent season lengths.  It's kind of a shame to get into something and then, eight episodes later, it's done for the year.

 

So the Life On Mars finale is Tuesday.

Anna and I are two episodes into the current season now.  Is it just me, or those first two, or is this season rather darker than the first one?

[Alasdair5000]

The other nice thing about BBC series is that they End. There isn't the pull to make them last as long as possible, even into the shark-jumping bits (Doctor Who aside, though it does manage to un-jump as much as it has jumped at times) that American series seem to fairly universally share.

Largely true from what I've seen, although the end of Coupling did get somewhat bizarre. 

I just wish the British series I liked had decent season lengths.  It's kind of a shame to get into something and then, eight episodes later, it's done for the year.

  Oddly enough, that's something that's been discussed over here quite a bit.  The BBC quietly extended their season runs a little while ago and most of their premier shows now run 8-13 episodes where previously they'd run six.  Doctor Who's been one of the field leaders with this, with its 13 episode seasons.  Stuff like Spooks and Hustle isn't far behind with about eight.  Althouggh now I come to think about it, I think Doctor Who went twenty episodes a season regularly back in the '80s.

So the Life On Mars finale is Tuesday.

Anna and I are two episodes into the current season now.  Is it just me, or those first two, or is this season rather darker than the first one?[/quote]

   It's not just you.  There are a couple of episodes later on that get very dark indeed.

[Heradel]

Alasdair, you may be thinking of the old practice of breaking up a story into 25 minute chunks, so one story would be told in 4 or 6 annoyingly short chunks rather than a 50 minute all at once thing. The current (45 minute) format for The Doctor started with this reincarnation.

----

It has been getting darker, but I've been thinking that's a reflection of his losing hope he'll pull out of the coma slash be released by the mysterious man on the phone.

Spoiler below.
Did anyone else think that the temporary replacement for the Gov was an older version of Sam?

[Heradel]

Well, c'est fini. And in a satisfying way.

Spoiler effing alert. Do not read below unless you saw the finale. !

I'll go back to what I said before: BBC shows End¹. And this one had a good ending that wouldn't have happened in a US show. To a certain extent Sam's ultimate realization that he likes it better in 1973 is inevitable: we barely see any of the characters from the present and the policing in the present has no... character/fun to it. Plus it would really be very unsporting for him to not be with Cartwright at the end.

Other's thoughts?

---
¹Exception of The Doctor.

[Alasdair5000]

Well, c'est fini. And in a satisfying way.

Spoiler effing alert. Do not read below unless you saw the finale. !

I'll go back to what I said before: BBC shows End¹. And this one had a good ending that wouldn't have happened in a US show. To a certain extent Sam's ultimate realization that he likes it better in 1973 is inevitable: we barely see any of the characters from the present and the policing in the present has no... character/fun to it. Plus it would really be very unsporting for him to not be with Cartwright at the end.

Other's thoughts?

---
¹Exception of The Doctor.

   I remember back when the first series finished being hugely disappointed.  It seemed for all the world like they'd had a clear eight episode run with a definitive ending in place and when the second series had been comissioned had had to do some frantic last minute rewrites.  Now, with the final series done, I'm really glad they got the second year.

   That was flat out one of the gutsiest ways to end a TV show I've ever seen, second, perhaps to the closing moments of St Elsewhere.  The sequence with Sam on the roof and the final, long delayed and absolutely perfect use of 'Life On Mars' was one of the most powerful bits of TV I've seen this year.  The actual ending as well, one part grim to two parts genuinely happy and extremely poignant, was pretty much note perfect.  I especially liked the reversal of the first episode's final scene, which again saw Sam on a building poised to jump into his new life.  Just beautifully judged drama.

   The thing that fascinates me about it (And triggers my inherent lit geek tendencies) is the concept of the spin off, ASHES TO ASHES.  Which, in case anyone wants to be surprised by, I will attempt to spoiler text-ise. 

Highlight to read.  Hopefully.

  The current plan is for it to be set in London in 1981 with Gene, Chris and Roy being reassigned to a London CID unit.  They're joined by a female officer and profiler whose daughter is kidnapped in 2007 and who is injured in an attempt to get her back. 
   Now, already a lot of people are asking why an officer working in an entirely different city could possibly hallucinate the same officers that Sam did.  The possibilities being discussed are:

-As a profiler, she read the details of Sam's case, including his presumed descriptions of the CID unit and as a result, she transplants them into her own hallucinations.
-Gene and co are in fact a Moorcockian/post modern set of archetypes, the 'Eternal guv' as someone described him.  Any cop, when injured, will see and interact with them.
-She really does go back to 1981 and interacts with them, implying that everything Sam saw and experienced was real. 

   The other question concerning the spin off is where are Sam and Annie?  I suspect that they'll be held in reserve for the season wrap up, given that the new female lead encountering Sam, happy and alive in 1981, would raise some very interesting questions about what's real and what isn't.

[SFEley]

Okay.  Anna and I finished watching the series last night, so I can finally read this thread again.  >8->

I was floored.  I was expecting a bizarro "not really an ending" ending, something like The Prisoner or so many anime series (Evangelion and Escaflowne, I'm looking at you).  Instead they ended it, leaving no ambiguity as to what was going on, and with just enough denouement for emtional satisfaction.  I was beginning to expect it as soon as they said "We couldn't remove the tumor," but that's fine.

And really, it's the only way the probability wave of the series could collapse.  I'd been struck the entire time by how over-the-top most of the episodes were, but they made that make sense.  The character dynamics and the plots were implausible because they didn't have to be plausible; the whole thing was the cop show in Sam's head.  So of course the whole department only ever had one crime to solve at a time.  Of course there were about twenty people working there but only four of them ever talked.  Of course police officers beat the crap out of each other on a regular basis to express their opinions.  I wasn't going through the series expecting him to finally choose the fantasy, but they made that make sense too.  The bartender's lines were very clear and strong there.

And yeah.  Annie.  (I've asked Anna for a WPC Cartwright for Christmas.  Damn, she's cute.  Not a WDC Cartwright, though, only because I prefer the uniform.)  >8->

Spin-off series: I'd heard nothing about that, and have mixed feelings.  I guess that throw-away bit at the end about him recording things for the psychologist was the set-up for that?  On the one hand it sounds totally absurd, and I don't know why they'd bother.  On the other hand, the premise for Life on Mars was absurd enough to begin with, and they made that work...  If it does come to pass, someone be sure to post here and let me know if it's worth checking out the premiere.

This was a really good show. 

[stePH]

The other nice thing about BBC series is that they End. There isn't the pull to make them last as long as possible, even into the shark-jumping bits (Doctor Who aside, though it does manage to un-jump as much as it has jumped at times) that American series seem to fairly universally share.

Largely true from what I've seen, although the end of Coupling did get somewhat bizarre. 

Coupling lost it when Jeff departed the show; Oliver was a poor substitute. Tambien, I didn't care for the "Susan is pregnant" story arc.

I want to check out Life on Mars but NetFlix doesn't have them stream-able yet.

[Ocicat]

Wow, that's some threadomancy there, steph. 

Life on Mars (BBC version, anyway) was great.  I only just read Steve's analysis (I wasn't on the boards when it was first posted!) and it's right on the money.

But if you haven't seen the series yet, do yourself a favor and know as little as possible about it before you start.  It's a unique show, and you don't want it spoiled.

[Talia]

Only seen one episode of the BBC version. Gotta admit I loved the American one though. Although the ending was a bizarre copout.

[stePH]

Only seen one episode of the BBC version. Gotta admit I loved the American one though. Although the ending was a bizarre copout.

haha... copout... I see what you did there 

[stePH]

...okay, NetFlix has the US version streamable now, but not the UK original. I'm going to be home for a couple of weeks so I've queued it up.

[stePH]

Okay, finished watching the (US) series this morning. I feel used. I feel badly used. 

I hope the original ends differently.

[Ocicat]

Uh, ya.  I haven't seen the US version (I was warned away from it early on) but from what I've heard about it's ending... I assure you the original has nothing at all like that.  At all.

[stePH]

Uh, ya.  I haven't seen the US version (I was warned away from it early on) but from what I've heard about it's ending... I assure you the original has nothing at all like that.  At all.

I was hoping as much... that the American producers wanted to have a different ending just to keep the surprise and mystery alive for those who had seen the original (which I still want to check out; I guess I'll have to get it a disc-at-a-time from NetFlix)

I swear, if this show were any more of a shaggy dog story, it would have clumps of dried shit stuck to its furry behind 
I don't know how to rate it on NetFlix... I don't think it will let me split between a "Really Liked It" for 16+3/4 episodes, and a "Hated It" for the ending.