The "Carne Asada" Defense

[stePH]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury ... this is prepackaged carne asada.  It sells for $6.99 a pound at Trader Joe's.  It's thin-sliced beef sirloin in a spicy marinade.  Now this is the thin-sliced beef sirloin, no marinade.  It sells for $7.99 a pound.  Why does the same meat with no marinade cost a dollar more per pound than the marinated meat?  It just doesn't make sense!  And why am I even talking about the price of meat at Trader Joe's?  Again, it just doesn't make sense!  If it doesn't make sense, you must acquit.  Thank you, and the defense rests.


(eat your heart out, Johnny Cochran  )

[Russell Nash]

The marinade let's you use meat that has gone bad.

[sirana]

Here, look at the monkey. Look at the silly monkey!

[wintermute]

Well, lower quality cuts, at the very least.

If they're actually selling bad meat, then that would be a very bad thing.

[Tango Alpha Delta]

Here, look at the monkey. Look at the silly monkey!

My head just exploded!   

[Russell Nash]

Here, look at the monkey. Look at the silly monkey!

My head just exploded!   

Was that a wookie?

[eytanz]

Well, lower quality cuts, at the very least.

If they're actually selling bad meat, then that would be a very bad thing.

It's probably not bad meat, but it's probably closer to being bad. If the edible shelf life of the meat is, say, a week, they could easily take 5 day old meat, marinate it, and put it back on. That serves several purposes:

A - It makes the meat shiney again.
B - People will be more likely to buy marinated meat with a short shelf life, as they will assume it's the marinade that will go bad, not the meat.
C - If the marinade is acidic or salty, it could extend the life of the meat somewhat.
D - Possibly, the meat's flavor/smell deteriorates before it becomes dangerous to eat. A marindate could obscure this. (I just threw out some chicken breasts today because one of them smelled, very faintly, like eggs. The faintness of the smell meant that it was probably entirely safe to eat once cooked, but I wasn't willing to risk it. If it was marinated, I would not have noticed. And from the supermarket's POV, as long as they are not breaking any laws, it's preferrable I get food poisoning (which could not be necessarily tracable to the meat I bought from them), than bad smelling but safe meat, which is tracable to them and will discourage me from buying more meat there.

[stePH]

It's probably not bad meat, but it's probably closer to being bad. If the edible shelf life of the meat is, say, a week, they could easily take 5 day old meat, marinate it, and put it back on.

Have you ever been to Trader Joe's and seen this stuff?  It's sold in vacuum-sealed plastic prepackaging.  I don't think they do it on-site; it's more likely done at some regional processing plant.  If they pulled the "sliced beef sirloin" out of the meat case, trucked it back to be marinated and repackaged as "carne asada", and back to the store again, it would almost certainly have gone over by then.

(it's also very good, but tightening food budget means we don't buy it any more.)

[Windup]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury ... this is prepackaged carne asada.  It sells for $6.99 a pound at Trader Joe's.  It's thin-sliced beef sirloin in a spicy marinade.  Now this is the thin-sliced beef sirloin, no marinade.  It sells for $7.99 a pound.  Why does the same meat with no marinade cost a dollar more per pound than the marinated meat?  It just doesn't make sense!  And why am I even talking about the price of meat at Trader Joe's?  Again, it just doesn't make sense!  If it doesn't make sense, you must acquit.  Thank you, and the defense rests.


(eat your heart out, Johnny Cochran  )

My guess is that the marinaded meat is of a significantly lower USDA grade, which costs less.

USDA grades don't have anything to do with safety -- all grades meet the same safety standard -- but have to do with internal "marbling." Marbling is flecks of fat in the meat, which is what makes beef tender and juicy, which Americans tend to like, and which they pay more for.  (Maybe non-Americans like it, too. I just don't have first-hand experience. Though I've heard Argentinians prefer tougher, but more flavorful, grass-finished beef.  But I digress...)

Anyway, the highest grade is Prime, which has the most internal fat and costs the most, down through Choice and Select, the latter being the lowest grade usually sold in stores, though I think I've seen Standard show up as stew meat.  Price falls off dramatically with declining grade.  My guess would be that since marinade, like marbling, makes for meat that is more tender and flavorful, the store relies on the marinade to produce an acceptable product from a cheaper grade of meat.  (One might reasonably ask why they don't just pocket the difference, but that's probably another whole discussion on market share, price points, and consumer segmentation.)  

[eytanz]

It's probably not bad meat, but it's probably closer to being bad. If the edible shelf life of the meat is, say, a week, they could easily take 5 day old meat, marinate it, and put it back on.

Have you ever been to Trader Joe's and seen this stuff?  It's sold in vacuum-sealed plastic prepackaging.  I don't think they do it on-site; it's more likely done at some regional processing plant.  If they pulled the "sliced beef sirloin" out of the meat case, trucked it back to be marinated and repackaged as "carne asada", and back to the store again, it would almost certainly have gone over by then.

(it's also very good, but tightening food budget means we don't buy it any more.)

No, I haven't been to Trader Joes, but it's just as likely stuff that took longer to get out of whereever it is they marinate it rather than stuff off the shelves.

There could also be other explanations - maybe it's meat with visual blemishes that marinading will obscure. Or maybe, as mentioned above, it's simply meat that's slightly lesser quality to start with. Or maybe it just comes from a different supplier. Who knows? Trader Joe moves in mysterious ways.

[Anarkey]

(Maybe non-Americans like it, too. I just don't have first-hand experience. Though I've heard Argentinians prefer tougher, but more flavorful, grass-finished beef.  But I digress...)

It's not tougher.  Often it's less tough.  As a bonus, also more flavorful.  Though perhaps an equally fed cow here would be tougher and it's just the rocking pampas topsoil that makes the difference in that sweet, sweet grass.

[Windup]

(Maybe non-Americans like it, too. I just don't have first-hand experience. Though I've heard Argentinians prefer tougher, but more flavorful, grass-finished beef.  But I digress...)

It's not tougher.  Often it's less tough.  As a bonus, also more flavorful.  Though perhaps an equally fed cow here would be tougher and it's just the rocking pampas topsoil that makes the difference in that sweet, sweet grass.

Since you sound like you have first-hand knowledge, I defer.  I've only read descriptions of it from generally-reliable sources. 

In any case, less marbling...

[Anarkey]

Since you sound like you have first-hand knowledge, I defer.  I've only read descriptions of it from generally-reliable sources. 

In any case, less marbling...

Well, you're really just deferring to my taste buds.  It's not like I'm a cattle rancher or an expert in herbivore biology or anything.  Though I'm sad for you not having had a chance at the first-hand knowledge.  Take it if you can get it.

Giving myself a serious hankering for a lomito right now. 

Still, if twenty years of Argentine steak consumption counts, then by all means, defer away! 

As to the marbling question, there may well be less.  It's hard to tell just by eating it because they slice the cow up differently.  Kind of like how "bacon" is a different part of pig depending on where you're from.

[Heradel]

Skirt steak.

[Windup]

As to the marbling question, there may well be less.  It's hard to tell just by eating it because they slice the cow up differently.  Kind of like how "bacon" is a different part of pig depending on where you're from.

You can't really see marbling once the meat has been cooked.  The little flecks of fat melt into the surrounding flesh. 

Generally grass-finished beef has less marbling because the cows get more exercise.  I imagine they have better cardiovacular health as well, but that doesn't do them much good... 

[stePH]

Skirt steak.

I saw that episode.  Alton Brown is one of my heroes -- a true geek chef.

Yes, true "carne asada" is skirt steak.  But the stuff at Trader Joe's is (as aforementioned) thinly sliced sirloin.  It's amazing how closely it resembles skirt steak though.

[Anarkey]

You can't really see marbling once the meat has been cooked.  The little flecks of fat melt into the surrounding flesh. 

Generally grass-finished beef has less marbling because the cows get more exercise.  I imagine they have better cardiovacular health as well, but that doesn't do them much good... 

This evokes the fondest memories in me of herders yelling their heads off at me for chasing their cattle on horseback.  "Don't make them run!"  they yell.  "Ha, ha, ha!"  I yell, and continue to chase their open grazing cows around.  I guess now I know what they were on about. 

[Tango Alpha Delta]

Too much serious about meat.  Laugh:

[Russell Nash]

umm..  I was joking about the meat going bad.  I thought it was rather obvious that it was quality of the original cut and standard supply and demand forces at work.

[Listener]

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury ... this is prepackaged carne asada.  It sells for $6.99 a pound at Trader Joe's.  It's thin-sliced beef sirloin in a spicy marinade.  Now this is the thin-sliced beef sirloin, no marinade.  It sells for $7.99 a pound.  Why does the same meat with no marinade cost a dollar more per pound than the marinated meat?  It just doesn't make sense!  And why am I even talking about the price of meat at Trader Joe's?  Again, it just doesn't make sense!  If it doesn't make sense, you must acquit.  Thank you, and the defense rests.


(eat your heart out, Johnny Cochran  )

Related:

http://metafrantic.livejournal.com/77600.html

Cheaper to fly Boston > Denver > Colo. Springs than just Boston > Colo. Springs.

[wintermute]

I've found that rather than flying from Cincinnati to Orlando (for example, this is true of other destinations too), it's often cheaper for me to drive up to Dayton, fly from there to Cincinnati and change onto the exact same plane I would have taken otherwise.

[Listener]

I've found that rather than flying from Cincinnati to Orlando (for example, this is true of other destinations too), it's often cheaper for me to drive up to Dayton, fly from there to Cincinnati and change onto the exact same plane I would have taken otherwise.

Have you re-figured that out with gas prices incorporated?

I think if you're on the shorter leg first -- ie, the leg closer to your house -- that's workable, but this person lives in Boston and was going to Colorado Springs, so he would've had to rent a car (and possibly a car seat for his child if he didn't want to pay the additional fee for checked baggage).

[wintermute]

Have you re-figured that out with gas prices incorporated?

I'm actually about midway between the two airports, so it ends up costing the same for fuel. But even if I lived in one of the airport hotels at CVG, Dayton is only... about three gallons away, so any saving over $30-$40* is still gravy.

I think if you're on the shorter leg first -- ie, the leg closer to your house -- that's workable, but this person lives in Boston and was going to Colorado Springs, so he would've had to rent a car (and possibly a car seat for his child if he didn't want to pay the additional fee for checked baggage).

Yeah, it's definitely easier this way around.

*EDIT: Forgot that you'd need to drive back again afterwards.

[Listener]

Have you re-figured that out with gas prices incorporated?

I'm actually about midway between the two airports, so it ends up costing the same for fuel. But even if I lived in one of the airport hotels at CVG, Dayton is only... about three gallons away, so any saving over $30-$40* is still gravy.

I think if you're on the shorter leg first -- ie, the leg closer to your house -- that's workable, but this person lives in Boston and was going to Colorado Springs, so he would've had to rent a car (and possibly a car seat for his child if he didn't want to pay the additional fee for checked baggage).

Yeah, it's definitely easier this way around.

*EDIT: Forgot that you'd need to drive back again afterwards.

I've never lived in a place that didn't have direct service to where I wanted to go, though I used to live 20 minutes from FLL and 45 from MIA (if there's no traffic), so MIA was always an option.  Everyone flies directly to Orlando, though, so it was just a matter of finding the right time to buy.  And Atlanta is a hub to everywhere.

Though my dad hates MIA so much that he said if the flight was cheaper there than to FLL, he would give me the extra $20-$40 so he wouldn't have to drive there and pick me up.  Which says something about MIA.

[stePH]

Related:

http://metafrantic.livejournal.com/77600.html

Cheaper to fly Boston > Denver > Colo. Springs than just Boston > Colo. Springs.

Great ... now we have the "Boston to Colorado Springs" Defense too?  Murderers and rapists will soon be walking free in droves.